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Problem solved in an unexpected way.
In my surfing the net in search of USB analogue video capture devices, I found that the info on Windows 8/8.1 compatibility in the product specifications is very hazardous. As a matter of fact, I bought a product that claimed such compatibility and that proved not to be true. In the process, I became aware of the importance of the drivers and that many firms were not updating them for Windows 8/8.1.
Trying to find out the firms that updated their drives, I was lucky and bumped into the site of the guy/firm that makes the video drives for EzCAP.TV (that is where I bought the EzCAP 116 device) and several other products/makes (including, for instance, Pinnacle’s Dazzle device).
The site (easycapexpertti.mybisi.com) contains information on drivers by firm and product model, information that is not provided by EzCAP.TV itself. For the model of my device, the driver that is provided in EzCAP’s CD is not even mentioned (probably because it is obsolete, as I suspected for a 2009 driver, pre-dating Windows  . The other drivers are mainly for Windows XP to 7, not for Windows 8/8-1. There is only one driver for Windows 8 which, by comparison, I found to be the 2012 driver that EzCAP experts suggest as an alternative for users who want to use the device with Skype, MSN, etc.. Well, it happens to be the only driver that works under Windows 8! I had already installed and tried it before and found that it managed to capture the video, but the accompanying audio is awfully distorted. However, the site has the solution, because there is a note for Windows 7 users with a trick that I immediately saw that would work for Windows 8 as well: to replace the audio driver contained in the Video/Audio driver by a native Windows audio driver. There is even a YouTube tutorial on how to do that using the driver updating facilities of the Windows 8 Device Manager.
I tried it. I installed the 2012 driver, kept the video component and “updated” the audio driver to a native Windows driver called USB Audio Device. It works. I already captured with good video and audio quality using Power Director 12 (naturally, this solution works also for other programs that I have been using for comparison and tests).
In summary, Windows 8.1 is not to blame in this case and the EzCAP box is OK. But the package box/drivers that EzCAP.TV claims to be Windows 8 compatible comes with a 2009 driver that is not Windows 8 compatible. And the 2012 driver that EzCAP suggests as an alternative for complaining clients has a faulty audio component. This can be fixed by a “trick”, but they do not provide the adequate information, neither in the installation instructions nor in the Technical Support/Forum.
I lost more than a month in installations, uninstallations, reinstallations, questions, experiments, fear that I had a bought a faulty laptop or that I had badly tampered with the OS, etc.. And I was lucky to discover yesterday this solution that saves me from spending more money on an alternative device with no guarantee that it would work. Anyway, all is well that ends well.
For the record and for other users that might have the same problem, I can summarize here the results of the now unnecessary research that, following your suggestions, I did to find reliable USB analogue video capture devices for Windows 8/8.1
1) Many devices/drivers have not been upgraded from Windows 7 to Windows 8/8.1. Furthermore, Amazon and the like are still selling the Windows 7 versions, even when Windows 8/8.1 versions are available from the manufacturer. However, even when the description of the product indicates Windows 8/8.1 compatibility, this is not necessarily so (in my case, for example, I was cheated). One has to contact the manufacturer and ask about it, even if a positive reply is no guarantee. The best bet is to ask commercial support whether new versions have been made to take Windows 8 into account and make sure you buy those versions.
2) In Europe, it is very difficult to get hold of Windows 8/8.1 VHS video grabber. First, EzCAP seems to be the only local supplier (their package works, if you know the trick that I just learned at my cost). Second, even for suppliers that, in the US, are offering Windows 8/8.1 versions, the versions sold in Europe are still Windows 7 (I only found one exception for a product in Amazon Germany). If you try to buy directly from the US, there is the problem that some manufacturers and online stores do not ship to Europe or estimate exorbitant shipping costs (I had an estimate of about $100 of shipping costs for $40 worth of product).
This topic can be closed now. Thank you all for your prompt replies and for your contributions.
Edgar
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Thank you all.
I am checking your suggestions. I am facing 2 problems, though.
1) The EzCAP product I bought from the UK also announced Windows 8 compatibility, and it does not work (no wonder, the drivers were made in 2009; an alternative driver dated 2012 also does not work). No one has actually said that had personal experience of the capture device under Windows 8/8.1, that would be reassuring.
2) The products announced in the US as Windows 8/8.1 compatible are not available in Europe. Amazon.uk and Amazon.fr have Windows 7 versions of Hauppage. I only found Windows 8 Hauppage in Germany, but I do not speak German to read the instructions and make sure it is a Windows 8/8.1 version.
Has anybody heard of Diamond MultiMedia VC500? Apparently, there is a VC500CXT version for Windows 8. It has good recent reviews (a site of top tens), a representative in Europe and a fair price ($40, before shipping costs). That was my first choice. I did not buy it then because... Well, I cannot remember why anymore: either they did not ship to Portugal or shipping was too expensive or they required PayPal and, at the time, I only had MBNet.
I will go on researching the matter. And maybe waiting a little more, someone will came forward with actual Windows 8.1 experience.
Thank you again.
Edgar
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Billy
Thanks a lot for your prompt reply.
I am not familiar with these makes, but I will look for Hauppage and for Total Recorder in Google.
With respect to upgrading to Windows 8/8.1, I had no choice, my old Windows XP became obsolete and, in my country, they are only selling laptops with Windows 8 pre-installed.
I hope I will still have the contribution of someone with real experience in Windows 8.1.
Thanks again
Edgar
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Does anybody know of a USB Video Capture Device for analogue video signal that works in a Windows 8.1 environment, for me to use with Power Director 12?
I still have VHS cassettes that I want to convert to MPEG files and to DVD.
In the past, with Windows XP, I had the Pinnacle bundled solution that worked fine.
Now, I upgraded to a laptop with Windows 8.1 and lost the Pinnacle hardware/software in the process.
To replace the video software, I bought Power Director 12, and I am happy with it.
To replace the capture box, I bought EzCAP 116 USB Video Capture Device (mainly because the publicity says it is Windows 8 compatible and, as I live in Europe, because it ships from the UK).
Unfortunately, it was a bad choice. In my soon-to-be-disposed-of Windows XP laptop, it works fine. But, in my new Windows 8.1 laptop, it does not work. Sometimes, it does not capture the VHS/VCR signal at all. In other occasions, it captures the video but the audio is either not present or is awfully distorted. This happens both with Power Director 12 and with the video software that comes with the capture device. I have been in touch with EzCAP Technical Support and I have been through a nightmare of installing, uninstalling and reinstalling drivers. No way to get it working. I suspect that the device driver has been prepared for, at most, Windows 7, not for Windows 8/8.1.
Does anybody know something that works in Windows 8.1?
Thanks in advance for any help that you can provide.
Edgar
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Dear Carl
Thank you for your reply.
1) OGG audio
You are right. OGG seems to be a container format which, in addition to video, can contain audio obtained by various methods (various Codecs), including an uncompressed format.
However, the most common audio found in OGG files seems to be of the Vorbis format, which is both compressed and lossy. It usually comes in files with the .ogg extension (though, technically, the audio only OGG files should have the extension .oga) and is more commonly known as Ogg Vorbis or just Vorbis audio format.
I used your “OldRuggedCross” test file in the WAV version to create .ogg audio files. With Audacity, it is the export option “OggVorbis files”. With Format Factory, it is the conversion option “OGG” in the Audio Tab. In Any Audio Converter and in Any VideoConverter it is the conversion option “OGG Vorbis audio (.ogg)”.
The resulting files all have .ogg extensions and they are all identified as having audio format “Vorbis” and compression mode “lossy” both by MediaInfo and Format Factory.
So, what is usually called OGG audio is this compressed and lossy Vorbis version.
I also found reference to an OggPCM audio Codec or format. As far as I understand, it is an uncompressed digital audio format similar to what is found in Compact Disc Digital Audio (.cda files), in Microsoft’s PCM format (.wav files) and in Apple’s PCM format (.aiff files). I have never seen an OggPCM file and I do not have the means to create one starting from a .wav file. I wonder how MediaInfo and Format Factory would identify such files. Probably with “PCM” for the audio format and no information on the compression mode.
2) Audio files read by Power Director 12
Thanks for the 7 “OldRuggedCross_test” audio files provided by you. To these 7 files, I added up the .ogg file I obtained by converting your .wav test file.
Importing all of them into PD12 was tricky and I only found out how to do it because I knew you had been able to do it. As a matter of fact, the “Import Media Files” window of my version of PD12 only detects audio files with the following extensions: *.wav; *.mp3; *.wma; *.ogg; and *.m4a. As a consequence, it did not show the test files with extensions .aac, .ac3 and .mp2. To make them visible and select them for import, I had to choose “All files (*.*)” in the Files Type tab.
This way, PD12 imported all the 8 audio files and played them both from the Library and from the Timeline. There is one exception, though: the .aac file does not play from the Library, only after it is dragged into the Timeline. This is strange. As a matter of fact, .mp4 video files with AAC audio and independent .m4a audio files (also AAC audio) are perfectly read by PD12. So, why should independent AAC audio files be read only in the Timeline? Anyway, having to place the file in the Timeline to be able to play it is just a minor inconvenience.
So, except for this detail, my version of PD12, like yours, reads the test files.
[Incidentally, I also experimented with a FLAC file (lossless compression) which I created by using Format Factory to convert the .wav test file, but PD12 does not import it.]
In summary, the problem that led me to ask the current question has been solved, and I learned a lot in the process. Thanks to you, I found that the cause of my problem was that PD12 does not read the audio Ogg Vorbis content of video files (at least in mp4 files, like mine, and in .ogv files, like yours), but that it reads that very same audio format when it comes in an independent audio file. Also thanks to you, I learned how to extract and separate the Ogg Vorbis audio content and to recover it by reinserting it in the Timeline as an independent audio file. Finally, I became aware that I should avoid loss by unnecessary conversions and that I should use wave audio (.wav) whenever available from the source.
Thanks a lot for the attention you gave to my question.
Edgar Rocha
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Dear Carl
You are right, it is complicated. But putting together your replies with some research in the net (Wikipedia mainly, together with Audacity’s Help and Vorbis’ Site) things became a little less obscure.
1) To make PD12 accept to edit a video file with OGG/VORBIS audio content
You asked me if I had tried using OGG audio file in PD12 (because, according to PD12’s Help, OGG audio is supported). No, I had not. So, with Audacity (Any Audio Converter or Format Factory can do the same, I believe), I extracted the audio track of the MP4 video file and saved it as an independent OGG audio file. Then I imported it to PD12 Library and dragged it to the Timeline. PD12 played it perfectly well. So, you are right, PD12 supports OGG audio if it comes in an independent audio file. So, your statement that no conversion of the audio track should be needed because PD12 reads OGG audio is correct.
However, afterwards you noticed that OGV video files imported to the Library and dragged to the Timeline become soundless. And you added that one can solve that problem by replacing the soundless audio track of the video file by an independent OGG or WAV audio file extracted from the video file by Format Factory. In other words, what you showed is that, with a separate audio file, one can make PD12 accept the OGG audio that was rejected when it came as a component of the video file.
To apply your idea to my case, I had to do one instrumental conversion. As opposed to what happens with your OGV video file, it is impossible to import my MP4 video file with OGG audio into the PD12 Library: the program just closes down. So, I had to use Format Factory to convert the MP4 video file with OGG audio into a similarly MP4 video file, but with AAC audio (it has to be to AAC audio, the WAV option is not available). Such a file can be imported into the Library and dragged to the Timeline. Then, one can unlink the video and the audio tracks, keep the MPEG-4 video and replace the AAC audio track by the separate OGG audio file extracted from the original video file. This is the way to remain as close as possible to the video and audio components of the original video file and avoid unnecessary conversions that always bring about some additional loss.
So, the problem of using PD12 to edit video MP4 files with OGG audio content like the one I downloaded from YouTube is solved.
2) Is there any advantage in converting the audio into WAV?
Before, I thought that I had to convert the audio to AAC or WAV because I suspected that PD12 did not read OGG audio. Now that I was proved wrong and a way has been found to edit OGG audio, the conversion of the audio into AAC becomes just a trick to make PD12 accept to import the video file.
However, you argued in favour of conversion to WAV audio, for 2 reasons.
First, OGG audio is uncompressed, just like WAV audio. Thereby, there would be no loss in the conversion OGG to WAV.
I have checked and rechecked before writing this: you are wrong, OGG audio is a method of lossy compression, just like MP3, MPEG-4’s AAC or Dolby Laboratories’ AC3/DolbyDigital (sources: Wikipedia and Vorbis’ Site).
[By the way, I learned that uncompressed (therefore, lossless) formats are mostly CD Audio, WAV (Microsoft’s 16 bit PCM) and AIFF (Apple’s 16 bit PCM). And that the most common lossless compression method is that of the FLAC (Free Lossless Audio Codec) format.]
The consequence is that it is useless to convert the OGG audio into WAV audio. As a matter of fact, what was lost in the OGG lossy compression cannot be recovered by reconverting to the WAV format.
So, from the point of view of the quality of the sound, it seems to me that it is better to stick to the OGG audio.
Your second argument is that WAV is very reliable in Power Director. This is a weighty argument, specially if the OGG or AAC audio formats raise problems.
If I am not very wrong, my problem and my doubts are solved.
Thank you very much for your help
Edgar Rocha
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Dear Carl
Thanks for the prompt reply.
OK. I understand that I have to convert the OGG audio before being able to import the MP4 file into PD12 for editing.
I tried Any Video Converter (which I found in the net) and Format Factory (which I found in the Forum). They both convert the audio component only to AAC (no option for WAV).
What I did is to use Format Factory to convert the audio from OGG to AAC, while keeping the AVC(H264) video format. Then, I imported into PD12 and edited the audio with Wave Editor to get a WAV file. It worked. At first “sight”, the resulting audio is OK.
I have 2 questions, though.
1) The way of getting to WAV audio
• Is my indirect way of getting from OGG to WAV audio Ok or is there a more direct way that I did not find?
2) The loss question in the audio conversion
I understand that AAC is a lossy compression (I learned that in Wikipedia) and what is lost in going from OGG to AAC cannot be recovered by reconverting into WAV.
Furthermore, as far as I know, the MPEG-4 files produced with PD12 have AAC audio.
• So, what is the advantage of reconverting into WAV? Why not stick to AAC audio?
Thanks in advance for your help.
Edgar Rocha
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I am sorry for my naive question, but I am a beginner in these matters.
I have Power Director DeLuxe 12 (version 12.0.2930.0, with updating patch installed; SR number VDE140423-01) and, in addition to Windows 8.1 Codecs, I have installed the K-Lite Mega Codec Pack.
In my initial experiments, I used DVDVideoSoft’s FreeYouTubeDownload to download 2 music videos from YouTube that I wanted to try to join and edit. Both files have mp4 extensions, but while one was nicely read by PD12, the other was not imported (there was not even an error message: PD12 just closed down).
I did my homework before resorting to the Forum.
With MediaInfo, I learned that
• Both files are MPEG-4;
• Both files have an AVC video stream;
• The file that is imported by PD12 has an AAC audio stream;
• The file that is not imported by PD12 has an Ogg audio stream.
Reading Forum questions I learned that I could check the Product Specifications in the CyberLink’s Site. They say that PD12 imports:
1) Video files of the MPEG-4 AVC format: it is the case of both files;
2) Audio files of the WAV, MP3, WMA, M4A, OGG formats: strangely enough, this does not cover the file that is read by PD12 (it has AAC audio stream, which is included in the list) and it covers the file that is not read by PD12 (it has Ogg audio stream, included in the list);
3) Audio Formats AAC, Dolby Digital, Dolby Digital Plus, WAVE, MPEG-1 Layer III: this sounds more normal, because this list covers the file that is read by PD12 (AAC audio stream, included in the list) and does not cover the file that is not read by PD12 (Ogg audio stream, not included in the list).
I am not sure I understand these data. Does this mean that PD12 imports independent audio files of the Ogg format, but does not import MPEG-4 video files with an Ogg audio component? That is strange for me, but it would explain why the video file with AAC audio is read while the video file with Ogg audio is not.
Is my interpretation correct? Or is my system missing something, like appropriate Codecs? How can I use PD12 to edit the MPEG 4 files with Ogg audio?
Does anybody have information that can help me? Thanks in advance.
Edgar Rocha
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