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PD15, edit existing motion tracker
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sdolcourt [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jan 15, 2017 15:07 Messages: 12 Offline
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Hi, Forum,

Problem I'm having is that if I create motion tracking as to blur the faces of people in the clip, there is no obvious way (after the clip is OK'd) to edit the existing trackers.

When I re-open the clip to edit it, I get a fresh tracker, but the previously created trackers are not listed / shown in the edit window.

Is this a PD15 bug, or is there a way to have existing trackers show? Seem like they should.

Cheers,

Seth
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PowerDirector Moderator
Contributor Private Message Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan Joined: Oct 18, 2016 00:25 Messages: 596 Offline
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Please see this post:

https://forum.cyberlink.com/forum/posts/list/78086.page

Cheers
PowerDirector Moderator

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jan 11. 2019 02:38


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sdolcourt [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jan 15, 2017 15:07 Messages: 12 Offline
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Quote Please see this post:

https://forum.cyberlink.com/forum/posts/list/78086.page

Cheers
PowerDirector Moderator


Thank you for the link, moderator, I gave the thread a solid read.

From a user standpoint, it's logical to return to the same tool to edit trackers. Imagine starting your car in the morning using the normal method, but then for each subsequent re-start, you have to insert the key into the glove box lock.

That's really the message for the poduct team, is keep the user process consistent for object creation and editing.

Quite a story, that thread....
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BetoValle [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Nov 15, 2013 11:27 Messages: 35 Offline
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I make a simple test, creating 2 tracker s, saved and closed pdr15. I reopened the project, clicked on the video, selected motion tracher, and there were the 2 trackers, the way I've saved. Normal!

Or I did not understand your project!
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sdolcourt [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jan 15, 2017 15:07 Messages: 12 Offline
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Quote I make a simple test, creating 2 tracker s, saved and closed pdr15. I reopened the project, clicked on the video, selected motion tracher, and there were the 2 trackers, the way I've saved. Normal!

Or I did not understand your project!


Yeah, I don't get that result.

My workflow is to trim the clip first, then apply trackers.

I created motion trackers of blurred circles to obscure faces, changed the default label of Tracker 1 and Tracker 2 to Blur 1 and Blur 2, save, close, power off, go get coffee.

When I re-open PD15 and the project, the clip does have the orange "i", indicating an effect is applied. I click on the clip, and mouse click Tools | Motion Tracker, but..... I don't see the previous trackers that I made; no Blur 1 Blur 2. I only get the default of Tracker 1.

So my issue is dead-exactly that of WeRunWithScissors2, in the hyperlinked thread provided by the moderator.


I've installed PowerDirector_3929_GM7_Patch_Patch_VDE180212-01 for good meaure. No dice.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jan 14. 2019 21:21

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optodata
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: California, USA Joined: Sep 16, 2011 16:04 Messages: 2896 Offline
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Yeah, I don't get that result. I created motion trackers of blurred circles to obscure faces, changed the default label of Tracker 1 and Tracker 2 to Blur 1 and Blur 2, save, close, power off, go get coffee.

When I re-open PD and the project, the clip does have the orange "i", indicating an effect is applied. I click on the clip, and mouse click Tools | Motion Tracker, but..... I don't see the previous trackers that I made; no Blur 1 Blur 2. I only get the default of Tracker 1.

I've installed PowerDirector_3929_GM7_Patch_Patch_VDE180212-01 for good meaure. No dice.

You'll only get the tracking object on a separate track if you choose a title or image in the MT tool. Those are easier to work with afterwards, because the new object on the timeline has all of the keyframes created by the MT tool, and you can open the object directly and edit them as needed. No need to reopen the MT at all.

However, when you add an effect as the tracking object, nothing is placed on the timeline and you get the inconsistent behavior you've described.

One possible workaround is to create a blurred circle and save it as an image. Then, select that image in the MT as your tracking object, and you can size and position it just like an effect. The difference is that you'll be able to work with it later on if you want to change its size or position.
youtube/optodata


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sdolcourt [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jan 15, 2017 15:07 Messages: 12 Offline
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You'll only get the tracking object on a separate track if you choose a title or image in the MT tool. Those are easier to work with afterwards, because the new object on the timeline has all of the keyframes created by the MT tool, and you can open the object directly and edit them as needed. No need to reopen the MT at all.

However, when you add an effect as the tracking object, nothing is placed on the timeline and you get the inconsistent behavior you've described.

One possible workaround is to create a blurred circle and save it as an image. Then, select that image in the MT as your tracking object, and you can size and position it just like an effect. The difference is that you'll be able to work with it later on if you want to change its size or position.


Hi, Optodata,

I'm in California, too. NorCal, tucked away in the East Bay.

Correct, I don't see a separate track, so I'm slowly getting the message that FX (not title or image) is the problem child. Thank you for clarifying that the separate track is created for title / image.

Interesting work-around, I generally understand it. Rather than have PD create the blur FX, make one of my own as jpg or png or whatever, and connect it to MT using the image process, which will show up as a separate track that's easier to edit.
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BetoValle [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Nov 15, 2013 11:27 Messages: 35 Offline
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sdolcurt

Now I understood and checked that objects were not on the timeline.
I really confirm your manifestation that pdr15 does not store the objects, it just leaves indicating that trackers have been used, inside the motion tracker module.
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optodata
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: California, USA Joined: Sep 16, 2011 16:04 Messages: 2896 Offline
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Quote Hi, Optodata,

I'm in California, too. NorCal, tucked away in the East Bay.

Correct, I don't see a separate track, so I'm slowly getting the message that FX (not title or image) is the problem child. Thank you for clarifying that the separate track is created for title / image.

Interesting work-around, I generally understand it. Rather than have PD create the blur FX, make one of my own as jpg or png or whatever, and connect it to MT using the image process, which will show up as a separate track that's easier to edit.

I'm in the Bay Area as well.

The MT tool seems to expect that you'll to get everything set the way you want before leaving. Certainly, the new frame-by-frame tool is very helpful when you're initially setting up the tracker, but it's not as effective if you can't reliably go back in and access the keyframes.

As you saw in the thread that the moderator linked to, Cyberlink is aware of the problems caused by linking the MT directly to each actual clip, and it's going to take a lot of work to change things under the hood.

That also means that we're not likely to see a change in the near future to allow a clean, more intuitive MT re-entry, so working with tangible timeline objects is probably the better approach, especially if you think you may need to tweak things later.
youtube/optodata


Director Suite 365 | Win10 Pro | 8 Core/16 thread i9-9900K (4.8GHz) | RTX 2070 | nVidia 419.35 | ASUS PRIME Z390-A | 6.2TB SSDs | 4TB HDD | 32GB RAM | (12GB RAMDrive)
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sdolcourt [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jan 15, 2017 15:07 Messages: 12 Offline
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That also means that we're not likely to see a change in the near future to allow a clean, more intuitive MT re-entry, so working with tangible timeline objects is probably the better approach, especially if you think you may need to tweak things later.


That seems a very good read of the tea leaves. Thank you for the advice to explore using images, I'll give that a try.
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sdolcourt [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jan 15, 2017 15:07 Messages: 12 Offline
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Quote sdolcurt

Now I understood and checked that objects were not on the timeline.
I really confirm your manifestation that pdr15 does not store the objects, it just leaves indicating that trackers have been used, inside the motion tracker module.


Hi, BetoValle,

I was having trouble with my words, I didn't fully express that I was using FX. It would have made problem replication easier. However, we all got there in the end, and the technical issue seems well understood.

Now I have a pile of clips to edit, pasting an image over faces.

Cheers!
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sdolcourt [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jan 15, 2017 15:07 Messages: 12 Offline
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Hi, Forum,

As feedback, my results with using an image (technically, a .png) linked to the motion tracker, rather than the blur or mosaic FX, is no different than before: when exiting the MT tool, and going back in, the MT tool does not display the existing trackers, it only offers a new tracker. And, of course, the .png in the timeline track directly below the clip.

It is what it is. The earth still rotates on its axis. Peace and love.
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optodata
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: California, USA Joined: Sep 16, 2011 16:04 Messages: 2896 Offline
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Quote Hi, Forum,

As feedback, my results with using an image (technically, a .png) linked to the motion tracker, rather than the blur or mosaic FX, is no different than before: when exiting the MT tool, and going back in, the MT tool does not display the existing trackers, it only offers a new tracker. And, of course, the .png in the timeline track directly below the clip.

It is what it is. The earth still rotates on its axis. Peace and love.

There is a difference, though. With the standalone image on the timeline you're able to change its size and position at any point via the Keyframes tool. That's especially helpful if you just need to tweak it at a specific location or two. Just remember that you need to select the actual tracking image clip (not the clip you used MT on) to use the Keyframes tool.

I also do see the original tracker when I reopen the MT tool; it's just not very useful.

As I wrote in the thread that the moderator linked to at the beggining of this thread, the tracking object isn't present, so there's no way to adjust its properties.

Also, even if I make big changes, like selecting a completely different item in the video to track and clicking the Track button again, the tracking object doesn't get updated after saving and exiting the MT tool.

HOWEVER, I have just found that there's a way to "recover" most of the original tracker's functionality!

After re-opening the MT tool, right-click on the existing tracker, and choose Copy Tracker, and voila! An exact copy appears with the ability to add a new title, image or Fx, and now you can then access the frame-by-frame tool or make any other desired changes to the track and get a new, updated timeline object.

The downside is that you have to re-create the original tracking object's size and location relative to the tracker, starting from the beginning. Still, in some situations that may be a better/quicker option than trying to adjust lots of keyframes on the tracking title/image on the main timeline.

This is certainly not a perfect solution, but between using an image (rather than Fx) and replicating the original tracker, you'll at least be able to deal with some post MT edits.
youtube/optodata


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sdolcourt [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jan 15, 2017 15:07 Messages: 12 Offline
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There is a difference, though. With the standalone image on the timeline you're able to change its size and position at any point via the Keyframes tool. That's especially helpful if you just need to tweak it at a specific location or two. Just remember that you need to select the actual tracking image clip (not the clip you used MT on) to use the Keyframes tool.
...

HOWEVER, I have just found that there's a way to "recover" most of the original tracker's functionality!

...
.


Thank you, I've given your post a read, and will try it this weekend. Whether I can make it work for me or not, I'll just keep trucking.

You've been very helpful, and I'm most appreciative!

Probably my best bet is treat the motion tracker as a one-shot edit, where I just need to be right about everything, before exiting.
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