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PowerDirector de-interlace at Produce always, even when asked profile is interlaced
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Roland vl [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Nov 23, 2017 03:44 Messages: 34 Offline
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Hello,

I recently bought PowerDirector and I was very impressed about the speed of rendering. But...



I have a bunch of m2ts-clips from my camcorder sony AX-53: 1920x1080-50i, thus interlaced. I verified this visual with VLC-player: I see combing faults on moving objects: good. Now I Produce with PD with the same attributes as my clips (output m2ts - 1920x1080-50i).

When then I play this result movie I do NOT see any combing anymore...but the header of the file says (Mediainfo: interlaced - TopFieldFirst) .



I did that also with other type of files: dv-avi, mpg2, ... It is always de-interlaced result.

Is this normal or am I missing something?



Roland
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Roland vl [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Nov 23, 2017 03:44 Messages: 34 Offline
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Update. The stuttering (because of the de-interlacing) happens only when there are at least 2 clips on the time line. I asked support for help. I ‘ll report back of the result of this.

Quote

I have a bunch of m2ts-clips from my camcorder sony AX-53: 1920x1080-50i, thus ....


I did that also with other type of files: dv-avi, mpg2, ... It is always de-interlaced result.
...

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PepsiMan
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: Clarksville, TN Joined: Dec 29, 2010 01:20 Messages: 893 Offline
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AVI is 25 years old.

if you're in PAL country, then FHD & HD Lower Field FIRST. for SD Top Field FIRST when you're doing the final output.



in NTSC(US of A) FHD & HD is UPPER FIELD first and SD is LOWER FIELD first for final output.

PD will do the best file output for you with slight noise reduction, s/n ratio, color correction, etc...

you can always create a custom profile to your liking if you want to stay behind in 25 years old quote unquote lossless file or don't like whatever PD automatically does it for you.



happy happy joy joy

PepsiMan

'garbage in garbage out' 'no bridge too far'

Yashica Electro 8 LD-6 Super 8mm
Asrock 970 Extreme4, W7Pro 64, AMD FX 8370E, MSI GTX1060 6GB, Corsair 16GB/RAM
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Samsung Galaxy Note3/NX1
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Roland vl [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Nov 23, 2017 03:44 Messages: 34 Offline
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Quote

'garbage in garbage out'


You missed my point. My camera Sony AX53 makes 1920x1080i50 m2ts-files, which are interlaced. I consider these files not as "garbage". I am very pleased with the quality of these clips when I show them on my 123cm flat Samsung TV-panel and of course on my PC monitor.

I want to produce a video-film with the same attributes, this is: 1920x1080i50 which is interlaced. There is a default profile foreseen in the Produce-step. But when I verify the result file, frame by frame, I see that the result clip not is interlaced. I do not say that the result is 'garbage', but anyway it is less smooth than my original, PD has trowed away moving information from my original clips, which creates stuttering in fast moving objects or pans. What you get (you see) is in fact 1920x108p25-video. Strange is, that this is in contradiction with the information of the header(the meta-data), still talking about 1920x1080i50.

I verified this malfunction of PD with older interlaced format: dv-avi, mpeg2 because I have in my archives still these formats. Some clips dating from 2004. For example I have a lot of 720x576 Pal-clips and it was not considered as 'garbage' in 2004.

What I do not like is that PD decrease the quality by converting them to progressive frames. And if it is progressive framing, then the header of the video files must say this.

(the information about first/last field for SD/HD-material in PAL country is totally wrong)
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PepsiMan
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: Clarksville, TN Joined: Dec 29, 2010 01:20 Messages: 893 Offline
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Quote ... You missed my point. ...


k. you missed my point, too.

if you don't like PD default settings that is ruining your videos, then you can always create a custom profile setting for your oldies but goodies... within the custom profile you may choose upper or lower field first, adjust profiles and video & audio bitrates, etc...



happy happy joy joy

PepsiMan

'garbage in garbage out' 'no bridge too far'

Yashica Electro 8 LD-6 Super 8mm
Asrock 970 Extreme4, W7Pro 64, AMD FX 8370E, MSI GTX1060 6GB, Corsair 16GB/RAM
Dell XPS L702X i7-2860QM, W7P / W10P 64, Intel HD3000/nVidia GT 550M 1GB, Micron 16GB/RAM
Samsung Galaxy Note3/NX1
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Roland vl [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Nov 23, 2017 03:44 Messages: 34 Offline
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Quote
Quote ... You missed my point. ...


... then you can always create a custom profile setting for your oldies but goodies...

'garbage in garbage out'




I have done that, same bug...
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PepsiMan
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: Clarksville, TN Joined: Dec 29, 2010 01:20 Messages: 893 Offline
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can you attach a sample 30 sec video from sony so i can troubleshoot and your PD rendering settings?

if it is a bug, then CL will find the solution.



happy happy joy joy

PepsiMan

'garbage in garbage out' 'no bridge too far'

Yashica Electro 8 LD-6 Super 8mm
Asrock 970 Extreme4, W7Pro 64, AMD FX 8370E, MSI GTX1060 6GB, Corsair 16GB/RAM
Dell XPS L702X i7-2860QM, W7P / W10P 64, Intel HD3000/nVidia GT 550M 1GB, Micron 16GB/RAM
Samsung Galaxy Note3/NX1
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PepsiMan
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: Clarksville, TN Joined: Dec 29, 2010 01:20 Messages: 893 Offline
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sorry Roland, i couldn't replicate your claim using my Everio .m2ts. even the trial version of PD16 produced interlaced .m2ts container top field first in default or custom profile settings.

attach your sony ax53 .m2ts file. ???

p.s. trying to attach video of PD16 rendering .m2ts file but CL's 14.4K connection will not finish the upload!

happy happy joy joy

PepsiMan

'garbage in garbage out'

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Dec 07. 2017 09:31

'no bridge too far'

Yashica Electro 8 LD-6 Super 8mm
Asrock 970 Extreme4, W7Pro 64, AMD FX 8370E, MSI GTX1060 6GB, Corsair 16GB/RAM
Dell XPS L702X i7-2860QM, W7P / W10P 64, Intel HD3000/nVidia GT 550M 1GB, Micron 16GB/RAM
Samsung Galaxy Note3/NX1
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Roland vl [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Nov 23, 2017 03:44 Messages: 34 Offline
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Quote sorry Roland, i couldn't replicate your claim using my Everio .m2ts. even the trial version of PD16 produced interlaced .m2ts container top field first in default or custom profile settings.



Have you put at least 2 clips on the time line?

And at produce step set: SVRT off?
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PepsiMan
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: Clarksville, TN Joined: Dec 29, 2010 01:20 Messages: 893 Offline
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Quote ... Have you put at least 2 clips on the time line?

And at produce step set: SVRT off?


post a pic of your project and if you can attach a short clip, sony ax-53 50i .m2ts. i can't even attach a 20MB file at my end right now... i am trying for two days and because of CL's 14.4K connection can't upload a video!

my Everio 60i .m2ts file came out as 60i .m2ts!



happy happy joy joy

PepsiMan

'garbage in garbage out' 'no bridge too far'

Yashica Electro 8 LD-6 Super 8mm
Asrock 970 Extreme4, W7Pro 64, AMD FX 8370E, MSI GTX1060 6GB, Corsair 16GB/RAM
Dell XPS L702X i7-2860QM, W7P / W10P 64, Intel HD3000/nVidia GT 550M 1GB, Micron 16GB/RAM
Samsung Galaxy Note3/NX1
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Roland vl [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Nov 23, 2017 03:44 Messages: 34 Offline
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Quote
....
my Everio 60i .m2ts file came out as 60i .m2ts!
...


And how have you verified that this result is interlaced, how have you seen that this is interlaced?
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Roland vl [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Nov 23, 2017 03:44 Messages: 34 Offline
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Quote
...
post a pic of your project and if you can attach a short clip, sony ax-53 50i .m2ts....


For your information I have following files on server:

The original file from my camcorder: https://uscloud01.powercloud.cyberlink.com/share/video/18fb5e5f-ac55-4f0b-83d7-4646179352cb

The result m2ts file after Produce:https://uscloud01.powercloud.cyberlink.com/share/video/eb285c8d-7d46-46c0-98a1-67c0a2de19da

A screenshot of the Produce-screen (see Profile name/Quality): 50i: https://uscloud01.powercloud.cyberlink.com/share/photo/85456d7e-5607-4f99-97cc-34c7b622bc00


View the result in a VLC-player, step by step, you see no combing, view the original file in VLC player: you see combing.



Conclusion: Powerdirector cannot produce interlaced material.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Dec 08. 2017 05:05

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PepsiMan
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: Clarksville, TN Joined: Dec 29, 2010 01:20 Messages: 893 Offline
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thanks Roland.

i say again, i can not upload the screen capture videos to the forum because of 14.4K connection setup that CL have. i'll get back to you with either snapshots and or short sample videos...



happy happy joy joy

PepsiMan

'garbage in garbage out' 'no bridge too far'

Yashica Electro 8 LD-6 Super 8mm
Asrock 970 Extreme4, W7Pro 64, AMD FX 8370E, MSI GTX1060 6GB, Corsair 16GB/RAM
Dell XPS L702X i7-2860QM, W7P / W10P 64, Intel HD3000/nVidia GT 550M 1GB, Micron 16GB/RAM
Samsung Galaxy Note3/NX1
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PepsiMan
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: Clarksville, TN Joined: Dec 29, 2010 01:20 Messages: 893 Offline
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k. Roland.

you're right about PD16 producing 50i .m2ts Interlaced into Progressive; however, ...



happy happy joy joy

PepsiMan

'garbage in garbage out'
 Filename
20171207_1414_37.jpg
[Disk]
 Description
50i progressive 25i interlaced m2ts
 Filesize
810 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
17 time(s)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Dec 07. 2017 16:01

'no bridge too far'

Yashica Electro 8 LD-6 Super 8mm
Asrock 970 Extreme4, W7Pro 64, AMD FX 8370E, MSI GTX1060 6GB, Corsair 16GB/RAM
Dell XPS L702X i7-2860QM, W7P / W10P 64, Intel HD3000/nVidia GT 550M 1GB, Micron 16GB/RAM
Samsung Galaxy Note3/NX1
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PepsiMan
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: Clarksville, TN Joined: Dec 29, 2010 01:20 Messages: 893 Offline
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since i don't have PAL, i've created custom profiles.

while CL is looking into the matter, your best bet is 25i, 29.97i, 30i & (maybe 60i). as you can see in the pics PD16 produced 60i to 29.97i...

see, now your pain lever is lower, much lower... ^^



happy happy joy joy

PepsiMan

'garbage in garbage out'
 Filename
20171207_1418_01.jpg
[Disk]
 Description
custom profile 60i progressive & default 60i interlaced m2ts m2ts
 Filesize
819 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
34 time(s)
 Filename
20171207_1416_37.jpg
[Disk]
 Description
29.97i & 30i interlaced m2ts
 Filesize
833 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
13 time(s)
 Filename
20171207_1430_44.jpg
[Disk]
 Description
NTSC default 60i m2ts setting
 Filesize
866 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
10 time(s)

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Dec 07. 2017 16:55

'no bridge too far'

Yashica Electro 8 LD-6 Super 8mm
Asrock 970 Extreme4, W7Pro 64, AMD FX 8370E, MSI GTX1060 6GB, Corsair 16GB/RAM
Dell XPS L702X i7-2860QM, W7P / W10P 64, Intel HD3000/nVidia GT 550M 1GB, Micron 16GB/RAM
Samsung Galaxy Note3/NX1
Reply
PepsiMan
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: Clarksville, TN Joined: Dec 29, 2010 01:20 Messages: 893 Offline
[Post New]
i have PD10, 12 & 14 and they do produce 50i interlaced .m2ts with custom profiles.



oh happy happy joy joy

PepsiMan

'garbage in garbage out' 'no bridge too far'

Yashica Electro 8 LD-6 Super 8mm
Asrock 970 Extreme4, W7Pro 64, AMD FX 8370E, MSI GTX1060 6GB, Corsair 16GB/RAM
Dell XPS L702X i7-2860QM, W7P / W10P 64, Intel HD3000/nVidia GT 550M 1GB, Micron 16GB/RAM
Samsung Galaxy Note3/NX1
Reply
[Post New]
Quote
Quote

'garbage in garbage out'


You missed my point. My camera Sony AX53 makes 1920x1080i50 m2ts-files, which are interlaced. I consider these files not as "garbage". I am very pleased with the quality of these clips when I show them on my 123cm flat Samsung TV-panel and of course on my PC monitor.

I want to produce a video-film with the same attributes, this is: 1920x1080i50 which is interlaced. There is a default profile foreseen in the Produce-step. But when I verify the result file, frame by frame, I see that the result clip not is interlaced. I do not say that the result is 'garbage', but anyway it is less smooth than my original, PD has trowed away moving information from my original clips, which creates stuttering in fast moving objects or pans. What you get (you see) is in fact 1920x108p25-video. Strange is, that this is in contradiction with the information of the header(the meta-data), still talking about 1920x1080i50.

I verified this malfunction of PD with older interlaced format: dv-avi, mpeg2 because I have in my archives still these formats. Some clips dating from 2004. For example I have a lot of 720x576 Pal-clips and it was not considered as 'garbage' in 2004.

What I do not like is that PD decrease the quality by converting them to progressive frames. And if it is progressive framing, then the header of the video files must say this.

(the information about first/last field for SD/HD-material in PAL country is totally wrong)








Hi,

Would you help try to use a custom profile to disable function "Use deblocking"?
 Filename
test.png
[Disk]
 Description
 Filesize
14 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
10 time(s)
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Roland vl [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Nov 23, 2017 03:44 Messages: 34 Offline
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Quote .... as you can see in the pics PD16 produced 60i to 29.97i...


The pics shows only info from MediaInfo, the meta data of the files. I have no problems with the meta data of my result files, they shows also the expected parameters (interlaced, top field first, etc...). As already explained the problem is the content, not the header of the video file.
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Roland vl [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Nov 23, 2017 03:44 Messages: 34 Offline
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Quote

...
Would you help try to use a custom profile to disable function "Use deblocking"?
...

I tried that, the result is the same: progressive frames in an interlaced container. Have you ever made an interlaced video with PD? Is it possible to see it?
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I made a test with a clip from my Pana HC-V160 in 1920x1080@25i.

Loaded in PD16.
Producing at MPEG2, 1920x1080@50i -> visually interlaced. Mediainfo says: interlaced

Making some editing, I did a stabilazation with standard values.

Producing at MPEG2, 1920x1080@50i -> visually not interlaced. Medainfo says: interlaced

It's correct, I produced it interlaced and it shows it. But what benefit do I have with interlaced material (If I need it, because of my hardware), if both of the half-pictures are completely the same?

Hatti Win 10 64, i7-4790k, 32GB Ram, 256 GB SSD, SATA 2TB, SATA 4TB, NVidia GTX1080 8GB, LG 34" 4K Wide, AOC 24" 1080
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