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Audio Sample Rate Slowed Down
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Reynold050 [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jun 28, 2017 13:51 Messages: 13 Offline
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I did a capture of a DV video to DV-AVI format. There are no available settings for this - these are determined by my DV tape. I am capturing a DVCAM tape with SR 48kHz audio. When the captured file .avi is opened by PD16, the audio is much lower in pitch and runs longer than the video. Properties panel says SR is 32kHz. But the same file plays OK in Windows 10 Photo player and in VLC Media Player. I cannot find any way to set the properties of the .avi file in PD as 48kHz.
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tomasc [Avatar]
Senior Contributor Private Message Joined: Aug 25, 2011 12:33 Messages: 5390 Offline
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I don’t have any problems with Firewire DV-AVI capture from Consumer DV tapes. DVCAM is the professional version that I don’t have. Try using WinDV to capture and see if the problem still exists. Would like for you to record say 10 minutes max of video and share it on Google Drive so users can check it out and suggest solutions.
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Reynold050 [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jun 28, 2017 13:51 Messages: 13 Offline
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Quote I don’t have any problems with Firewire DV-AVI capture from Consumer DV tapes. DVCAM is the professional version that I don’t have. Try using WinDV to capture and see if the problem still exists. Would like for you to record say 10 minutes max of video and share it on Google Drive so users can check it out and suggest solutions.



Thanks very much. I did get WinDV and it did make an .avi file with SR 48kHz, which PD 16 played easily - and it looks and sounds fine. Problem solved. Here is the link to Google Drive to get the 1-minute video which PD16 captured at 32kHz SR. The name of the clip is Waves 32k SR.avi. The first 5-6 seconds are black/silent.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/12Eyd51406t4sA0z2ojM23vw8dyPo-ULC/view?usp=sharing
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JL_JL [Avatar]
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: Arizona, USA Joined: Oct 01, 2006 20:01 Messages: 4485 Offline
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The file you have on google drive is 48kHz,

Audio
ID : 0-0
Format : PCM
Format settings : Big / Signed
Muxing mode : DV
Muxing mode, more info : Muxed in Video #1
Duration : 1 min 10 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 13.0 MiB (5%)

PD16 is just not reading file correctly. It works in the current PD19 version and versions prior to PD16. If you really want to capture in PD16, you can change the capture profile for other audio specifications.

Jeff

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Oct 12. 2020 15:33

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Reynold050 [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jun 28, 2017 13:51 Messages: 13 Offline
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Quote The file you have on google drive is 48kHz,

Audio
ID : 0-0
Format : PCM
Format settings : Big / Signed
Muxing mode : DV
Muxing mode, more info : Muxed in Video #1
Duration : 1 min 10 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 13.0 MiB (5%)

PD16 is just not reading file correctly. It works in the current PD19 version and versions prior to PD16. If you really want to capture in PD16, you can change the capture profile for other audio specifications.

Jeff


This file is changing specs depending on what software is looking at it. I am attaching the Properties panel from right-clicking on the filename in File Explorer in Windows 10. It shows a bit rate of 1024 kbps and an audio sample rate of 32 kHz, the same specs that PD16 displays. But when I open the same file in VLC Media Player, it shows the 48k SR. I am attaching this Properties panel also. VLC Media Player plays the file with correct audio pitch. PD16 plays it with the pitch lowered about half an octave.
[Thumb - Properties Waves 32k SR.jpg]
 Filename
Properties Waves 32k SR.jpg
[Disk]
 Description
 Filesize
57 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
1 time(s)
[Thumb - Properties Waves in VLC Media Player.jpg]
 Filename
Properties Waves in VLC Media Player.jpg
[Disk]
 Description
 Filesize
63 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
1 time(s)
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tomasc [Avatar]
Senior Contributor Private Message Joined: Aug 25, 2011 12:33 Messages: 5390 Offline
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Reynold050 - Thank you for the feedback and the screenshots. I may have the explanation for the Windows/Properties/Detail difference in reporting the Audio bitrate and sample rate compared to that on MediaInfo for the same exact DV-AVI capture. See the attached screenshot from my own DV captures. DV as I recall has an audio bit depth of 14 bits, 32 khz sample rate to allow audio mixing in the Sony Standalone DV tape editor. You can change the setting in my Sony camcorder menu from 14 bit to a 16 bit 48 khz audio recording in which I changed once I found that out. PD, all versions, and 5K player reports it as the same as in MediaInfo to be 16 bit 48 khz audio whether it is true or not.

PD9 can write back to DV tape. If SVRT is used then the audio will be the 32 khz 14 bit depth of the original. If SVRT is not used then the audio will be resampled to 48 khz 16 bit bit depth. Yes this is true that PD9 had SVRT for both video and audio, Later versions of PD SVRT applied the smart rendering only to the video. The audio is always resampled.

Looking at the file on Google Drive, it looks like the DVCAM capture is not that much different from consumer DV. It looks like that recording is also a PD16 edited and written back to DV tape as it has effects and titling added.

Glad that the WinDV worked properly in your capture of DVCAM content.
[Thumb - Reynold050.jpg]
 Filename
Reynold050.jpg
[Disk]
 Description
Windows Properties discrepancy with other viewers.
 Filesize
139 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
2 time(s)
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Reynold050 [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jun 28, 2017 13:51 Messages: 13 Offline
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Quote Reynold050 - Thank you for the feedback and the screenshots. I may have the explanation for the Windows/Properties/Detail difference in reporting the Audio bitrate and sample rate compared to that on MediaInfo for the same exact DV-AVI capture. See the attached screenshot from my own DV captures. DV as I recall has an audio bit depth of 14 bits, 32 khz sample rate to allow audio mixing in the Sony Standalone DV tape editor. You can change the setting in my Sony camcorder menu from 14 bit to a 16 bit 48 khz audio recording in which I changed once I found that out. PD, all versions, and 5K player reports it as the same as in MediaInfo to be 16 bit 48 khz audio whether it is true or not.

PD9 can write back to DV tape. If SVRT is used then the audio will be the 32 khz 14 bit depth of the original. If SVRT is not used then the audio will be resampled to 48 khz 16 bit bit depth. Yes this is true that PD9 had SVRT for both video and audio, Later versions of PD SVRT applied the smart rendering only to the video. The audio is always resampled.

Looking at the file on Google Drive, it looks like the DVCAM capture is not that much different from consumer DV. It looks like that recording is also a PD16 edited and written back to DV tape as it has effects and titling added.

Glad that the WinDV worked properly in your capture of DVCAM content.


Thanks for the explanation and the screenshot. It is true that DV can run at 32kHz 14-bit, but the miniDV cameras I have used all can also be set at 48 kHz 16 bit. My tape was entirely produced with a DVCAM PD150 camera and DVCAM studio equipment, all set for 48 kHz 16-bit depth. It was not PD 16 edited, it was edited and effect added with Final Cut Pro. I am not sure if or where MediaInfo exists in PD16. The equivalent that I can see, is right clicking on the clip in the timeline, which opens up a Properties panel. My experience with Properties was exactly opposite to yours with MediaInfo. It does not report the file as 16 bit 48 kHz, whether it is true or not. It reports the audio to be 14 bit 32 kHz. PD16 plays the video at standard speed but plays the audio at 32kHz, thus slowing it down, like a tape recorder playing back at 2/3 speed. The audio is out of sync.

I have made many transfers into PD from DVCAM tapes over the years, with PD6 and PD13. I have never had this problem before. But this is the first time I have tried it with PD16, which I used previously only to edit smartphone stills/movies for travel documentaries.

The DVCAM and consumer DV quality will always look the same. It is the same bitstream. The only difference is that the track on the DVCAM tape is physically larger, to reduce dropouts and losses.
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tomasc [Avatar]
Senior Contributor Private Message Joined: Aug 25, 2011 12:33 Messages: 5390 Offline
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MediaInfo is freeware that gives detailed information on video files. Since Windows file explorer is the only utility that gives the properties of the same audio as 12 bit 32 khz here then it is probably looking at the info at a different part of the video or using a lookup table for dv-avi. Jeff still has PD16 installed and already explained the PD16 result on his pc earlier.

This article has an explanation for the 12 bit not the 14 bit audio of dv that I thought and posted earlier: https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/209485-12-bit-or-16-bit-recording . Good reading.
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Reynold050 [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jun 28, 2017 13:51 Messages: 13 Offline
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Yes, there is no 14 bit audio, I should have spotted that. Good review of specs in videohelp. Bitdepth determines dynamic range, sampling rate determines frequency response. They are not inherently locked together but camera settings usually pair them into one selectable setting.

Very grateful for your time and generous support of this conversation. Many thanks for WinDV and MediaInfo. Please close this issue.
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Reynold050 [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jun 28, 2017 13:51 Messages: 13 Offline
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I still have the problem. I ran a new file using WinDV and PD19 sees it as 32kHz sampling rate. MediaInfo and other players confirm it is 48. I put it into PD to trim the file and produce the trimmed version as another .avi file. PD is not reading the file correctly, even though it did so yesterday with a different file. Any workaround?
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