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Playback and rendering slow after applying CLUT
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lawmans3 [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: May 30, 2019 19:47 Messages: 5 Offline
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Hello,

I just installed PD 17 and was trying to edit a dashcam video to get familiar with the software. The video clip is 1080p and 60 frames per sec (i think). When I apply any LUT to the clip the playback window shows signficant slow down, almost as if I have applied some type of slow motion effect. My rendering times are equally slowed down. I can apply some color correction manually (ie contrast or expsosure) without any slow down of any kind. I have tried changing the viewing resolution of the playback window but even with it set to the lowest setting it still just slowly putters along. I have shadow files turned on and off, makes no difference. My computer is an I7 (8 cores) running at 4Ghz, 32gb ram, Nvidia GTX 1070, data drive is an SSD. Here are my results using different settings on my export:

Test Video (2:28 total time, 1080P 60frames)
1 - no edits, small title added to the beginning of video. Render time 1 min 43 seconds
2 - minor exposure and color change manually, same title. Render time was the same 1:43
3 - one color lut (70's look), same title. Render time was 12 minutes 20 seconds

There must be a setting I have set somewhere that it doesn't like. If I do this same file, color grading in Davinci Resolve, the LUT changed immediatly and export times are all the same (fast)



Any help will be greatly appreciated!
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JOF [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jan 19, 2019 01:38 Messages: 17 Offline
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Quote Hello,

I just installed PD 17 and was trying to edit a dashcam video to get familiar with the software. The video clip is 1080p and 60 frames per sec (i think). When I apply any LUT to the clip the playback window shows signficant slow down, almost as if I have applied some type of slow motion effect. My rendering times are equally slowed down. I can apply some color correction manually (ie contrast or expsosure) without any slow down of any kind. I have tried changing the viewing resolution of the playback window but even with it set to the lowest setting it still just slowly putters along. I have shadow files turned on and off, makes no difference. My computer is an I7 (8 cores) running at 4Ghz, 32gb ram, Nvidia GTX 1070, data drive is an SSD. Here are my results using different settings on my export:

Test Video (2:28 total time, 1080P 60frames)
1 - no edits, small title added to the beginning of video. Render time 1 min 43 seconds
2 - minor exposure and color change manually, same title. Render time was the same 1:43
3 - one color lut (70's look), same title. Render time was 12 minutes 20 seconds

There must be a setting I have set somewhere that it doesn't like. If I do this same file, color grading in Davinci Resolve, the LUT changed immediatly and export times are all the same (fast)



Any help will be greatly appreciated!


This happens to me when I use the included "presets" in PD17. But NOT when I use a LUT (CLUT)
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lawmans3 [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: May 30, 2019 19:47 Messages: 5 Offline
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Quote


This happens to me when I use the included "presets" in PD17. But NOT when I use a LUT (CLUT)


OK, so the included LUT package slows the system down but why? I guess i'm glad to know it's not just me but then it makes me wonder why PD would not fix this issue. Seems like kind of a big one when the included LUTs bog the system down to a crawl? I like PD but this may be a deal breaker. I use LUTs quite a bit. Was this an issue on previous versions of PD or just PD 17?

If anyone has found a good work around for this please let me now, hopefully PD will correct the issue soon!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at May 31. 2019 11:13

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JOF [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jan 19, 2019 01:38 Messages: 17 Offline
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Quote


OK, so the included LUT package slows the system down but why? I guess i'm glad to know it's not just me but then it makes me wonder why PD would not fix this issue. Seems like kind of a big one when the included LUTs bog the system down to a crawl? I like PD but this may be a deal breaker. I use LUTs quite a bit. Was this an issue on previous versions of PD or just PD 17?

If anyone has found a good work around for this please let me now, hopefully PD will correct the issue soon!


You can find a bunch of free LUTs online. And they work great.
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johnfaust [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Location: Minnesota Joined: May 31, 2019 20:04 Messages: 1 Offline
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Any update?

Quote


You can find a bunch of free LUTs online. And they work great.
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lawmans3 [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: May 30, 2019 19:47 Messages: 5 Offline
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Quote


You can find a bunch of free LUTs online. And they work great.


Very cool, where? Do I search for LUT for PD or is there a certain type of LUT I need to look for? I will give this a try when I find out what kind are compatible with PD. Thanks for the response!
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JOF [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: Jan 19, 2019 01:38 Messages: 17 Offline
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Quote


Very cool, where? Do I search for LUT for PD or is there a certain type of LUT I need to look for? I will give this a try when I find out what kind are compatible with PD. Thanks for the response!


Any .cube or .log LUT will work with PD17.

Search for IWLTBAP free LUTS.

Check this out:

https://www.shutterstock.com/blog/129-free-cinematic-luts

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Jun 01. 2019 11:56

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lawmans3 [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: May 30, 2019 19:47 Messages: 5 Offline
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Quote

Any .cube or .log LUT will work with PD17.

Search for IWLTBAP free LUTS.

Check this out:

https://www.shutterstock.com/blog/129-free-cinematic-luts


OK, I downloaded from of these free LUT packs and have the same problem when they are applied. PD immiately slows down when the LUT is applied. As soon as I uncheck the LUT, it speeds back up. So it seems like there is some type issue with PD 17 when using any LUT(whether supplied by Cyberlink or free from another website). I'm surprised this hasn't been brought up sooner by someone else. If anyone has any other ideas, i'm open to trying them.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Jun 01. 2019 14:28

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optodata
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: California, USA Joined: Sep 16, 2011 16:04 Messages: 7097 Offline
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Quote I'm surprised this hasn't been brought up sooner by someone else. If anyone has any other ideas, i'm open to trying them.

I actually don't think many people use LUTs, or if they do, they're aware of how CPU-intensive they are and have adjusted their expectations and workflow to deal with them.

Like you've posted, I see PD's preview stuttering even after reducing the preview resolution, and a workaround for that is to switch to non Real-time. This will allow PD to fully draw each frame, even in Full HD preview resolution, but it will play slower than normal and there will be no sound.

To get past those restrictions, you'll want to break this into steps and take care of the most intensive edits first (the LUT). Here are 3 options:

  1. Remove all other titles and edits and produce the clip with only the LUT applied. This will take the longest to produce, and in my test project, producing just the LUT edit took 10:22 for the included 1:55 clip. For comparison, it takes my i9 only 0:18 to produce the clip on its own - so if it's taking you almost 2 minutes for just the clip + title, you may want to temporarily get rid of the title and try again.

  2. If you have the full DirectorSuite, you can apply the LUT in ColorDirector. In my testing, CDR produced the same clip with the same LUT in only 6:42, which is about 55% faster.

  3. The 3rd workflow may or may not give you the LUT's subtlest details, but it should be pretty close and it's vastly quicker. Take a 5-10 sec section of your source clip, apply the LUT and produce just that section. Bring the new clip to the timeline, then select it and your full original clip. Click on the Color Match tool and make sure that the reference clip is in the left window (use the swap button at the top center if they're in the opposite windows). Apply the color match, then delete the short clip from the timeline and produce the color-matched original clip. On my system that only took 0:47.


Once the LUT colors are "baked in" to the produced clip, you're free to replace your original clip on the timeline and then do all the other regular edits without paying any performance penalty. As a bonus, you'll likely be able to use SVRT when you produce the final version, and that might take only a few seconds, depending on what other kinds of edits you've added.

Try out these options and post back with your thoughts and results.
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lawmans3 [Avatar]
Newbie Private Message Joined: May 30, 2019 19:47 Messages: 5 Offline
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Quote

I actually don't think many people use LUTs, or if they do, they're aware of how CPU-intensive they are and have adjusted their expectations and workflow to deal with them.

Like you've posted, I see PD's preview stuttering even after reducing the preview resolution, and a workaround for that is to switch to non Real-time. This will allow PD to fully draw each frame, even in Full HD preview resolution, but it will play slower than normal and there will be no sound.

To get past those restrictions, you'll want to break this into steps and take care of the most intensive edits first (the LUT). Here are 3 options:

  1. Remove all other titles and edits and produce the clip with only the LUT applied. This will take the longest to produce, and in my test project, producing just the LUT edit took 10:22 for the included 1:55 clip. For comparison, it takes my i9 only 0:18 to produce the clip on its own - so if it's taking you almost 2 minutes for just the clip + title, you may want to temporarily get rid of the title and try again.

  2. If you have the full DirectorSuite, you can apply the LUT in ColorDirector. In my testing, CDR produced the same clip with the same LUT in only 6:42, which is about 55% faster.

  3. The 3rd workflow may or may not give you the LUT's subtlest details, but it should be pretty close and it's vastly quicker. Take a 5-10 sec section of your source clip, apply the LUT and produce just that section. Bring the new clip to the timeline, then select it and your full original clip. Click on the Color Match tool and make sure that the reference clip is in the left window (use the swap button at the top center if they're in the opposite windows). Apply the color match, then delete the short clip from the timeline and produce the color-matched original clip. On my system that only took 0:47.


Once the LUT colors are "baked in" to the produced clip, you're free to replace your original clip on the timeline and then do all the other regular edits without paying any performance penalty. As a bonus, you'll likely be able to use SVRT when you produce the final version, and that might take only a few seconds, depending on what other kinds of edits you've added.

Try out these options and post back with your thoughts and results.


Thank you!! I will give these a try and see how this workflow works for me. I appreciate the time to repsond!
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ynotfish
Senior Contributor Private Message Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9870 Offline
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Hi all -

My observations reflect some of what's been stated above. I used a 5 minute UHD clip from Sony RX10iii to try to quantify the impact of LUTs, presets & adjustments on production times.

The application of built in & custom presets has a much greater impact on production times than using LUTs, in both PDR17 & CDR7.

As optodata noted, production times are quite different between PDR & CDR.



The LUT & custom preset used above are attached.

Cheers - Tony
 Filename
Django 25.CUBE
[Disk]
 Description
 Filesize
864 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
120 time(s)
 Filename
Darken.cdadj
[Disk]
 Description
 Filesize
4 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
128 time(s)

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