SOLVED - Trying to share-attach PNG and Jpeg

CS2014

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-Eastern Time Zone Joined: Sep 16, 2014 16:44 Messages: 629 Offline

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Mar 03, 2016 10:03

I've been trying to respond to the thread about _D14 Low Resolution SNapshots. I've tried 2 times to attach a PNG and a Jpeg via saving it on Photobucket and then linking those images to the response. Additionally I've attached a WORD doc that has the screen captures of the MediaInfo for the two images.

I'm going to try to just get the PNG and JPEG to transfer in this thread... then maybe just the WORD doc in a new thread.

The pics... hopefully

" alt="VLC Snapshot PNG" id="__mcenew" />

And the JPEG PD 13 Snapshot

" alt="PD 13 Snapshot JPEG" id="__mcenew" />

Did this work - without the WORD doc?

CS
edit: wooo hooo.. it did!
Might try the WORD doc on a new thread - with very similar title.

Second edit:
Ok .. now what I was trying to communicate -
The VLC PNG image is clearer... is this because it IS a PNG - 24 Bitdepth according to the MediaInfo as the JPEG is only 8 BitDepth? I'm thinking that the JPEG format compresses differently and .. more I suppose - resulting in an image that is NOT as sharp as the PNG - is this true?

3rd Edit:
All the MediaInfo
PNG image - 2.5Mib - 1920-1080 - Bit Depth 24 bits - Compression Mode - Lossless Stream size: 2.5Mib (100%)
JPG image - 175 KiB - 1920-1080 - Bit Depth 8 bits - Compression Mode - Lossy - Stream size: 175 KiB (100%)

So- The VLC snapshot is cleaner-sharper- APPEARING to be a higher resolution -(but actually not) - since the PNG is not getting compressed like a JPEG does - is this correct?
CS

This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at Mar 03. 2016 22:08

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jcardana

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-NM Joined: Aug 04, 2014 10:11 Messages: 650 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 11:04

Are you not able to "attach" files directly on the post? It took a while for me to realize the two blue tabs at the bottom of the posting page. One is Options and the other is attachments.
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CS2014

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-Eastern Time Zone Joined: Sep 16, 2014 16:44 Messages: 629 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 11:40

NO I'm not attaching image files directly - don't think I've ever been able to do that. I upload to Photobucket adn then copy the llink of the image 'location' from there - and then that allows the image to be seen in the thread.

I'm curious though that the WORD doc isn't attaching. I thought I might have been able to do that in the past - but I could be mistaken.

Edit:
In past attempts to enter both images(pix) and the Word document - I had asked if PD could take SnapShots in PNG instead of JPG. It can and I see it in Preferences - File .. then hit the down-arrow and change the jpg to png.

I need to c do a side-by-side comparison though of the PNG form VLC and PNG from PD to see if either looks better.

CS

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Mar 03. 2016 11:49

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ynotfish

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9945 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 12:47

Hi CS -

You've already established that making comparisons between a JPG from PDR & a PNG from VLC is not really valid. As you've noted JPG has lossy compression.

Not only, but also... even comparisons of same format snapshots from PDR & VLC isn't going to lead you anywhere close to a conclusion

The two programs clearly process their snapshots in very different ways.

Example - using a UHD clip 3840x2160 I took snapshots of the same frame in each available format. Looking at file size alone doesn't tell you much, except that they're different.

Word documents can be attached in the same way as other media. Click Attachments > Browse... see attached

Here's a little toot showing how to embed images in the forum pages - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiJshsWhZCw

It's worth noting that if you don't resize your image to 800px wide (or less), it can throw out the page display - especially for members who access the forum via mobile device. You can constrain the proportions in the "Insert/Edit Image" box.

Cheers - Tony
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CS2014

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-Eastern Time Zone Joined: Sep 16, 2014 16:44 Messages: 629 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 15:56

Thanks Tony for the response and more information!

I suspected highly that comparing JPEG and PNG wasn't a valid comparison. However I did NOT know that comparing PNG to PNG - VLC to PD was NOT a valid comparison - until you stated so. Thank YOU for that bit if information!

Using file size - I understand will NOT reveal which format and type (VLC or PD) is better.

Does Bit Depth have anything to do with quality of still image?

I tried just what you have outlined as far as attaching a WORD doc to the thread. It just wasn't working earlier for me. All I was trying to share/show the MediaInfo comparisons of the PNG to the JPEG.

Edit:
I am trying to do what you have done - that is taking the exact same frame of a video and taking a snapshot in VLC and in PD to see which one appears sharper/clearer. The VLC Snapshot seems to have a 24 BitDepth while the PD has a 32 BitDepth (once I set PD to take snapshots with PNG as the format.

Edit #2 -
Just read a little on bit depth - so I've answered my own question - I believe a larger bit depth still image will allow for more tonal definition - but will also have larger file sizes.

CS

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at Mar 03. 2016 16:22

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jcardana

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-NM Joined: Aug 04, 2014 10:11 Messages: 650 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 16:36

Quote: I've tried 2 times to attach a PNG and a Jpeg via saving it on Photobucket and then linking those images to the response.

It's a terminology thing again. What I know as "attaching" is uploading to the post. Like what you said, you're linking the images. That's where I got off track.

Quote: Here's a little toot showing how to embed images in the forum pages

Keyword here is "embed". In my mind, to "embed" and "link" say the same thing.

Quote: It's worth noting that if you don't resize your image to 800px wide (or less), it can throw out the page display

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jcardana

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-NM Joined: Aug 04, 2014 10:11 Messages: 650 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 16:40

Quote: I'm curious though that the WORD doc isn't attaching.

Again, you're not "attaching" you're linking. Since it's a word DOCUMENT as in ".doc" file, the forum may not know what to do with it. Are you using the "Insert/edit link" button or the insert/edit Image? If you Link the doc, I would expect to see the typical This is a link formatting. But this forum doesn't do that.

I also got thrown off because the subject changed from linking to image quality. That's a "no-no" on many forums but I'm glad we get away with it.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Mar 03. 2016 16:42

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CS2014

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-Eastern Time Zone Joined: Sep 16, 2014 16:44 Messages: 629 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 17:13

Right - I pretty much screwed up this thread from the 'get go' apologies guys.

I linked/embedded the pictures and they sucessfully got displayed in the thread. Ok they were a bit TOO LAGRE but I got them into the thread.

I tried to use the 'attachments' at the bottom of this Reply window in CL- to attach the WORD doc. Will try here now again with that same doc.

I tried and the result is the same - I hit 'Saving' and it churns a little .. but then stops.. and does not appear to be successfully attaching the Word Doc to the response.

The ORIGINAL INTENT... of the thread was to address the PNG vs JPEG Snapshot image quality (and the whole issue - I had a word doc that had the mediaInfo for both files in it that I was trying to include in the original post)... but.. diverged as I ran into this issue.

CS

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at Mar 03. 2016 17:16

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jcardana

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-NM Joined: Aug 04, 2014 10:11 Messages: 650 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 17:20

Quote: Right - I pretty much screwed up this thread from the 'get go' apologies guys.

I forgive you... I've done worse.

Quote: I tried to use the 'attachments' at the bottom of this Reply window in CL- to attach the WORD doc. Will try here now again with that same doc.

I'll give it a shot too.

Filename	This is a test.doc	Download
Description	A "test" Word document
Filesize	19 Kbytes
Downloaded:	302 time(s)

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jcardana

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-NM Joined: Aug 04, 2014 10:11 Messages: 650 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 17:21

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jcardana

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-NM Joined: Aug 04, 2014 10:11 Messages: 650 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 17:58

Another "attachment" test

Filename	This is a test.doc	Download
Description
Filesize	19 Kbytes
Downloaded:	293 time(s)

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CS2014

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-Eastern Time Zone Joined: Sep 16, 2014 16:44 Messages: 629 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 18:00

Na.. your's are attaching.. mine aren't . It'll either work itself out or not.. so.. o well.

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ynotfish

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9945 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 18:43

Shall we discuss attachments or bit depth? Agreed - alphabetical order

Attachments:

I don't know if you noticed (I didn't till now) but the Word document I thought I'd attached up there didn't make it. It was in .docx format.

I'll try again with the (older) .doc format.

Cheers - Tony

Filename	This is a Word document.doc	Download
Description
Filesize	22 Kbytes
Downloaded:	288 time(s)

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ynotfish

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9945 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 18:46

OK CS - that may be the issue. If you're using a more recent version of Office, Word documents are saved in .docx format. If you go to File > Save As & select "Word 1997-2003" it'll save as a .doc and attach happily.
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ynotfish

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9945 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 19:23

Bit Depth:

It's maybe a bit of a complicated thing, but essentially the greater the bit depth, the greater the tonal range - i.e. more colours. That results in a finer quality image & increased file size.

Images with very low bit depth can exhibit banding (e.g. a sky with bands rather than a smooth gradient)

You can find out more (if you wish) by clicking this or this or this

Cheers - Tony
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CS2014

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-Eastern Time Zone Joined: Sep 16, 2014 16:44 Messages: 629 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 21:12

You hit the nail on the head Tony - I've been trying to attach .docx files!

I was just about to try different file extension files to see what attached and what didn't but... you saved the day... again! Thanks!

Bit Depth... yep... what I had initially read was that tonal range increased with higher Bit Depth number as did file size.

Your 2nd 'this' ... was the document I found and read over - didn't read every word but got the idea from it. I saw the 3rd 'this' document too. And I wonder how crazy I may be for considering shooting stills in RAW format? Ah, only time will tell (how crazy I am).

Thanks so much for discovering the obvious - the .docx dilemma.... lol

CS ---- wooo hooo... lookie? lol (was able to attach a .doc)

Edit:
But I switched the PD FIle preferences to take PNG for Snapshots... and one of those Bit Depths was 32!!!!
Still need to do a side by side comparison VLG to PD me thinks - when I get time - off to Chicago for the weekend though tomorrow morn.

Filename	VLC - PD13 Snapshot MediaInfo Comparison-03.doc	Download
Description
Filesize	112 Kbytes
Downloaded:	311 time(s)

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at Mar 03. 2016 21:16

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CS2014

Senior Contributor Private Message Location: USA-Eastern Time Zone Joined: Sep 16, 2014 16:44 Messages: 629 Offline

Mar 03, 2016 21:17

I'm not really going to be able to post those high resolution - high Bit Depth pictures in a thread am I ? - at least not so that the full image can be seen as I think the images are too large to fit in the thread window. May have to only show portions of the pics VLC vs. PD ..... will give it a try sometime next week.

CS

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Mar 03. 2016 21:21

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