Solved: Bad Render for all formats...

Bitter Clinger

Newbie Joined: Jan 13, 2014 15:39 Messages: 16 Offline

Solved by

May 19, 2015 23:10

I'm using PowerDirector 13 on a Windows 8.1 system (i7-3770, GeForce GTX 970, 32 GB RAM). I haven't been able to render MPEG-4 or MPEG-2 videos for a couple of days. Each time I try, the finished product is "glitchy" with all kinds of artifacts, flashes, and all sorts of bad stuff in the video.

First, I thought it might be the new GeForce driver. The current version is 9.18.13.5286, and it was just released to coincide with the release of a hot new video game, Witcher 3. So, I rolled back to the previous version (9.18.13.4752), but I still had the same problem rendering with the old driver.

I have tried messing with shadow file settings and rendering settings to no avail.

There is plenty of room on the target hard drive, a USB 3.0 external drive with 260 GB free space. The project I'm rendering produces a 3 GB file.

The source video used in these projects all come from Nvidia ShadowPlay, and it plays perfectly as expected.

Finally, I can render these projects in WMV format with no trouble, and everything seems fine... except for the fact that it is WMV.

Any advice or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Here is an example of a Bad Render:

Here is the same source video rendered three days ago:

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at May 22. 2015 16:02

JL_JL

Senior Contributor Location: Arizona, USA Joined: Oct 01, 2006 20:01 Messages: 6091 Offline

May 19, 2015 23:22

My guess they are 60fps Nvidia ShadowPlay files and you are using HA in PD to encode. That's been a issues for PD. Try to uncheck "Fast video rendering technology:" and see if that fixes your issue.

Jeff

Bitter Clinger

Newbie Joined: Jan 13, 2014 15:39 Messages: 16 Offline

May 20, 2015 07:20

Quote: My guess they are 60fps Nvidia ShadowPlay files and you are using HA in PD to encode. That's been a issues for PD. Try to uncheck "Fast video rendering technology:" and see if that fixes your issue.

Jeff

Thanks for the reply. I just booted up my computer and made sure HA was disabled (it actually was already disabled). Still creates complete crap on an MPEG-4 render.

I appreciate the suggestion though, because I am at a complete loss. I would try uninstalling/reinstalling PowerDirector 13, but it is a digital copy, and I don't think I have the installer for it anymore. I would probably buy it again, if I had to, but I would hate to buy it a second time and still have the same problem.

Carl312

Senior Contributor Location: Texas, USA Joined: Mar 16, 2010 20:11 Messages: 9090 Offline

May 20, 2015 08:23

Jeff was talking about unchecking "Fast video rendering technology:" on the Produce Page.

Unchecking "Fast video rendering technology:" causes CPU rendering instead of the Video Card.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at May 20. 2015 08:23

Carl312: Windows 10 64-bit 8 GB RAM,AMD Phenom II X4 965 3.4 GHz,ATI Radeon HD 5770 1GB,240GB SSD,two 1TB HDs.

Bitter Clinger

Newbie Joined: Jan 13, 2014 15:39 Messages: 16 Offline

May 20, 2015 08:35

Quote: Jeff was talking about unchecking "Fast video rendering technology:" on the Produce Page.

Unchecking "Fast video rendering technology:" causes CPU rendering instead of the Video Card.

Yep, that's what I did. In fact, it was already unchecked from my experimentation yesterday. Sorry about the confusion, that was my fault. I was equating "HA" (GPU Acceleration) with the Fast Rendering feature. Again, Fast Rendering was disabled on the Produce page. The only option checked in the lower-left corner was Enable Preview.

Thanks for double-checking.

Bitter Clinger

Newbie Joined: Jan 13, 2014 15:39 Messages: 16 Offline

May 20, 2015 09:12

FYI - just tried uninstalling and reinstalling PowerDirector 13, but I still have the same problem.

Bitter Clinger

Newbie Joined: Jan 13, 2014 15:39 Messages: 16 Offline

May 20, 2015 12:56

FYI - Giving the Premium Phone support a try, it will make a great subject for a video either way.

optodata

Senior Contributor Location: California, USA Joined: Sep 16, 2011 16:04 Messages: 8630 Offline

May 20, 2015 13:05

Like Carl and Jeff mentioned, those kinds of artifacts almost always come from producing with the GPU and using the CPU by itself should solve that, so it's strange that you're not seeing any improvement.

With regard to the nVidia driver, try using a Custom Installation and uncheck everything except the graphics driver. Do this even if you normally use Miracast or 3d just to be sure that they aren't part of the problem.

It also might help if you could attach a short clip of the original ShadowPlay media so we could see what the results are when producing on our systems. You said you're producing to MP4, and I assume you're using 1920x1080/30p. What happens if you produce to M2TS at 1920x1080/60p? That's the format I always use for YT.

Finally, it's always helpful to see the DxDiag test results for issues like this. Please follow the steps *here* especially parts A, B and J.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at May 20. 2015 19:05

JL_JL

Senior Contributor Location: Arizona, USA Joined: Oct 01, 2006 20:01 Messages: 6091 Offline

May 20, 2015 13:15

If you can post a 10 second clip that when you render has a issue maybe someone can come up with a solution. The trigger is typically the variable fps of the shadowplay recording that can cause PD trouble. If the variable fps is the issue, about the only fix I know is a 3rd party package like Handbrake to create a PD compatible file for further editing.

The sample video would give a chance to interrogate the aspects of the video and try to find a suitable workaround.

Jeff

Bitter Clinger

Newbie Joined: Jan 13, 2014 15:39 Messages: 16 Offline

May 20, 2015 14:24

Quote: If you can post a 10 second clip that when you render has a issue maybe someone can come up with a solution. The trigger is typically the variable fps of the shadowplay recording that can cause PD trouble. If the variable fps is the issue, about the only fix I know is a 3rd party package like Handbrake to create a PD compatible file for further editing.

The sample video would give a chance to interrogate the aspects of the video and try to find a suitable workaround.

Jeff

I've attached three files here:

The result of rendering in MP4 - BAD

The original source video from ShadowPlay

A video of me producing the bad video mentioned above

All videos have been shortened using Movie Maker.

Filename	original_crop.mp4	Download
Description	Source_ShadowPlay_MP4
Filesize	39210 Kbytes
Downloaded:	202 time(s)

Filename	Troubleshoot_v1_crop.mp4	Download
Description	Bad_Render_MP4
Filesize	40405 Kbytes
Downloaded:	200 time(s)

Filename	Troubleshoot_v1_rendering.mp4	Download
Description	PD13_ProduceSettings
Filesize	18253 Kbytes
Downloaded:	169 time(s)

optodata

Senior Contributor Location: California, USA Joined: Sep 16, 2011 16:04 Messages: 8630 Offline

May 20, 2015 15:23

Thanks for the video clips. I'm concerned that Movie Maker may have re-rendered the original clip ShadowPlay when you shortened it. You could make a new brief recording and upload that or upload the full original ShadowPlay clip to OneDrive or Dropbox or similar cloud folder and share the link here.

You also mentioned that things were working correctly up until a few days ago. Two questions: Do you know of any new programs or updates (including Windows updates) that were installed in the past few days? Can you try a System Restore or use a system image to restore your PC to that point and see if the problem is still there?

EDIT: One way to tell if WMM changed the clip is to look at the media details in Windows Explorer, PD13, MediaInfo or player like VLC and look at the bitrate and frame-rate. If the original clip is anything other than AVC 30p (29.97fps) then WMM definitely produced a new version

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at May 20. 2015 15:33

Bitter Clinger

Newbie Joined: Jan 13, 2014 15:39 Messages: 16 Offline

May 20, 2015 17:02

You're right, Movie Maker did re-render the original. Here is a link to the original unedited clip as it was recorded by ShadowPlay:

https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=8F40C35FAE8FCA87!29393&authkey=!AMaPaae4Tu6FOc4&ithint=video%2cmp4

I also ran memtest86, so we can rule out bad memory.

As I stated in my original post, the only change to my system was the GeForce driver update for Witcher 3. I tried rolling back to the previous driver, and still had the same problem.

optodata

Senior Contributor Location: California, USA Joined: Sep 16, 2011 16:04 Messages: 8630 Offline

May 20, 2015 17:38

I'm not at my main computer (and won't be for another several hours), but your clip is recorded at 60fps and I'd like to see how PD performs if you produce it to the MT2S format at 60p.

It's the exact same setting you're using now but don't change the drop down box to MPEG-4 and use the 1080/60p setting. Let us know how that goes.

YouTube/optodata

DS365 | Win11 Pro | Ryzen 9 3950X | RTX 4070 Ti | 32GB RAM | 10TB SSDs | 5K+4K HDR monitors

Canon Vixia GX10 (4K 60p) | HF G30 (HD 60p) | Yi Action+ 4K | 360Fly 4K 360°

Bitter Clinger

Newbie Joined: Jan 13, 2014 15:39 Messages: 16 Offline

May 20, 2015 17:53

Okay, I have new information.

I can Import a raw ShadowPlay file, add it to the timeline (unedited), then produce an MP4 (or any other) version with no trouble.

However, if I Import that same file, add it to the timeline, then split out a small section and remove it; the render will be "bad" like I've shown in this thread. So far, ANY alteration of the original clip in the edit screen will result in a bad render.

optodata

Senior Contributor Location: California, USA Joined: Sep 16, 2011 16:04 Messages: 8630 Offline

May 20, 2015 18:07

Well, that's helpful info even if I don't quite yet understand what's happening. Are you using PD's shadow files when you import? If so, you'll probably need to wait until PD has fully rendered the lower-res versions.

You've got a great video card and plenty of RAM but only a so-so CPU, but you should be able to edit this with shadow files off.

Also, how does the output look if you produce to M2TS 60p?

EDIT: It sounds like PD is using SVRT when there aren't any changes and just copying the original clip (but skipping every other frame if you produced to 30p), although it seems like PD kicks in the full rendering engine for anything else. Hmmm...

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at May 20. 2015 19:04

Bitter Clinger

Newbie Joined: Jan 13, 2014 15:39 Messages: 16 Offline

May 20, 2015 19:00

Quote: Well, that's helpful info even if I don't quite yet understand what's happening. Are you using PD's shadow files when you import? If so, you'll probably need to wait until PD has fully rendered the lower-res versions.

You've got a great video card and plenty of RAM but only a so-so CPU, but you should be able to edit this with shadow files off.

Also, how does the output look if you produce to MT2S 60p?

EDIT: It sounds like PD is using SVRT when there aren't any changes and just copying the original clip (but skipping every other frame if you produced to 30p), although it seems like PD kicks in the full rendering engine for anything else. Hmmm...

I first started noticing these bad "artifacts" in the preview window on the Edit screen, and that's when I turned off shadow files. You're correct. I have no trouble at all editing my videos with shadow files turned off.

I did produce a couple of videos using M2TS, one at 60i and the other 60p. The M2TS/60p looked great, but with the caveat that if I tried to produce any video I have altered would be "bad".

I also have a little more information. Once I edit a video in the timeline, that project will never render ANY video without all those defects. In other words, if I remove the edited video from the timeline, then import a new video clip and add it to the timeline without editing; that project will produce a video with defects... and always will.

optodata

Senior Contributor Location: California, USA Joined: Sep 16, 2011 16:04 Messages: 8630 Offline

May 20, 2015 19:02

Well, I managed to get home much earlier than I was expecting and I've run a few tests. I split the video into 2 sections and produced the whole thing. Here are the results:

MP4 1080/30p Fast video + HVE = 0:41 producing time; no artifacts seen in VLC

MP4 1080/30p CPU only = 0:49 producing time; no artifacts seen in VLC

M2TS 1080/60p Fast video + HVE = 1:18 producing time; no artifacts seen in VLC

M2TS 1080/60p CPU only = 1:23 producing time; no artifacts seen in VLC

I've uploaded the produced clips to my OneDrive *folder* so please take a look and see if you see anything I might have missed

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at May 20. 2015 19:04

optodata

Senior Contributor Location: California, USA Joined: Sep 16, 2011 16:04 Messages: 8630 Offline

May 20, 2015 19:11

Quote: You've got a great video card and plenty of RAM but only a so-so CPU, but you should be able to edit this with shadow files off.

Bitter Clinger

Newbie Joined: Jan 13, 2014 15:39 Messages: 16 Offline

May 20, 2015 21:27

The files you rendered look good. So, it's definitely an issue with my system. After all, I've been working with these ShadowPlay source files for over a year now.

I'm thinking I should almost start a new thread. After a great deal of experimentation, I've found WMV has the same issue all other formats have when an edited video is rendered.

The premium phone support has already gone a little off into the weeds. They currently seem to be focusing on source video properties, and I think we can both agree that those ShadowPlay files are fine.

The basic problem now is that I cannot render edited movies. If I add a fade-in/out or even simply split a source video (without removing any part of it); the rendered movie is trash.

I also want to say thanks so much for all your help. This is so frustrating. I have another video already rendered and uploaded that I can simply click "Publish" on tomorrow morning, but I'll have to figure something out by next week. I have a hard dead line of next Thursday for rendering a heavily edited video and publishing it for a contest.

optodata

Senior Contributor Location: California, USA Joined: Sep 16, 2011 16:04 Messages: 8630 Offline

May 20, 2015 21:46

I can think of a couple more things to try. What happens if you import your original source clip into WMM and produce it (like you did with the cropped clips), then edit in in PD? Does that give you a usable output?

Also, what is the project's frame rate you're using? Mine is set to 60 FPS (NTSC) and there's a chance that changing yours if it was at 24 or 30 would make a difference.

YouTube/optodata

DS365 | Win11 Pro | Ryzen 9 3950X | RTX 4070 Ti | 32GB RAM | 10TB SSDs | 5K+4K HDR monitors

Canon Vixia GX10 (4K 60p) | HF G30 (HD 60p) | Yi Action+ 4K | 360Fly 4K 360°