Flicking images when using Magic motion

Anja the Dane

Contributor Location: Denmark (North of Copenhagen) Joined: Mar 03, 2011 15:02 Messages: 347 Offline

Solved by

Mar 12, 2015 15:12

Hi all,

Usually my videos only for private use. Our holiday pictures made into video.
I export them to my hard drive and then copy them to the NAS drive so I / we can watch them on TV screen or om PC.

I've got a very boring problem that I can not find the solution to and hope someone on the forum can give me some help.

When I make a motion in the images with Magic Motion I get flicking images some more irritating some less.
When I render the same images with motion in PD11 I don't have this problem, i.g. when someflicking should occur be its not quite as much as in pd13.

The problem is in both wmv and M2TS files.
Both for PD11 & PD13:
When I produce wmv I use the profile Windows Media Video 9 1280x720 / 25p.
When I produce M2TS I use the profile AVC 1280x720/50p (or25p) plus the Country/video format of disc: Denmark (PAL).

Cheers, Anja

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Mar 12. 2015 15:13

PDR 14.0.4207.0 / Windows 10 64-bit / Asus / Intel i7-4790 3.60 GHz / 16GB RAM / NVIDIA GeForce GTX 970 / DirectX 12

ynotfish

Senior Contributor Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9977 Offline

Mar 13, 2015 18:04

My post just vanished into the ether!

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ynotfish

Senior Contributor Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9977 Offline

Mar 13, 2015 19:15

Stupid thing! This my 4th attempt. All it had was a 100kb attachment and a few links. Poor impoverished little forum engine - I had to split the post for it to get here.

Hi Anja -

I guess you're referring to the shimmering that sometimes occurs when producing pans and zooms with still images. Perhaps you mean something worse!

There are so many variables, beginning with the resolution and visual complexity of the photos you're using. These 5 photos will give quite different results, from best to worst, as graphic complexity increases.

Perhaps you could provide more information about the photos you're using... maybe even attach one that's noticeable "flickering".

Cheers - Tony


Filename	Motion Thumbs.png	Download
Description
Filesize	103 Kbytes
Downloaded:	448 time(s)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Mar 13. 2015 19:17

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ynotfish

Senior Contributor Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9977 Offline

Mar 13, 2015 19:16

... and then there's the format & profile selected. In the examples below, I've used the same 5 images and applied the same motion with Magic Motion. Each video is produced to 16MBps.

WMV 720p version
M2TS 720p version
MPEG-4 1080p version

I also produced other versions, but didn't upload them. The 4K MPEG-4 @ 20MBps looks crisp and clean with barely a wrinkle. The 720p WMV @ 2MBps looks pretty terrible, especially with the final two photos.
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Anja the Dane

Contributor Location: Denmark (North of Copenhagen) Joined: Mar 03, 2011 15:02 Messages: 347 Offline

Mar 14, 2015 10:10

Hi Tony,
thanks for all your trial videos. To me they looks much better than mine produced with PD13.
Actually it is only a picture with the car I think there is flickering in the same way as in my pictures. I find the MPEG-4 best.
OK, the motion isn't smooth - mine are worse.

Some of my images of the sea - isn't included in the test - when using magic motion it looks like the sea is alive.

I've made some trials too using 5 images from my video project:

140926-0046 Rom 5184x3888
140926-0053 Rom 4000x3000
140926-0059 Rom 4000x2248
140926-0118 Rom 5184x3888
140926-0120 Rom 5184x3888

2 in 16:9 this match the TV screen and the PC monitor
Motion WMV 1280x720p 6MBps http://youtu.be/_zSDJO7m74Q
Motion M2TS 1280x720p 16MBps http://youtu.be/NM4wABGCuf4
and 1 in 4:3 as you did
Motion MPEG 4 1440x1080p 16MBps http://youtu.be/A5GDfxIoHkY

I always produce in HD because my camera records in AVCHD lite (16:9 HD) making mts files.

I also made 2 test with PD11.
Result much better - nearly no flickering and motion more smooth.

PD11 Motion AVC 1280x720p 24MBps http://youtu.be/3VZxaelaiqk
PD11 Motion AVC 1280x720p 24MBps http://youtu.be/bKcwklbYUHU

Hope this is enough information and hope a solution can be found.
Another bad thing is I can't import/open a PD13 project in PD11 - if that was possible I could just let PD11 do the rendering.

Cheers, Anja

PDR 14.0.4207.0 / Windows 10 64-bit / Asus / Intel i7-4790 3.60 GHz / 16GB RAM / NVIDIA GeForce GTX 970 / DirectX 12

AlS

Senior Member Location: South Africa Joined: Sep 23, 2014 18:07 Messages: 290 Offline

Mar 16, 2015 08:10

This is a genuine problem. I have the same shimmering results with a Motion Slide Show - especially with water shots. Very annoying - hope they fix it.
Thanks for all the tests. Power Director 13&14 Ultimate, Photo Director 6, Audio Dir, Pwr2Go 10
Win 10 64, Intel MB DH87MC, Intel i5-4670 CPU @ 3.40GHz, 16Gb DDR3 1600, 128Gb SSD, 2x1Tb WDBlue 7200rpmSATA6, Intel 4600 GPU, Gigabyte G1 GTX960 4GB, LG BluRay Writer

ynotfish

Senior Contributor Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9977 Offline

Mar 16, 2015 16:36

Anja & AIS -

The other variable we've inserted into the equation is YouTube and how it process video.

Absolutely, the shimmering with motion is an issue... but it can be minimised with:

clean, quality high resolution images

less motion

slower motion

producing to high resolution & bitrate

Anja - thank you for taking the time to upload your samples. I think the shimmering artifacts could be minimised by decreasing & slowing motion.

Cheers - Tony

Note to fellow YouTube video embedders - with the new rich text reply, use the https YT address

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Mar 16. 2015 16:40

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Anja the Dane

Contributor Location: Denmark (North of Copenhagen) Joined: Mar 03, 2011 15:02 Messages: 347 Offline

Mar 17, 2015 14:48

hi, thanks for your comment AIS & Tony.

I've made some more comparing tests using images with water.
All output filse are AVC M2TS 1280x720/50p @ 24MBps:

First, with Magic Motion in PD11 + PD13

Then these 2 side by side - Produced in PD11

Second, same images without motion in PD11 + PD13

Then these 2 side by side - Produced in PD11

I very nice thing is the images are much more sharp and colorfull when using PD13 than when using PD11 -
but the flickering is quite a bad thing.

Tony, I know you said: clean, quality high resolution images (really I try) -less motion - slower motion - producing to high resolution & bitrate (as far as i know I've done that).
I just want to be able to use the program facilities in the way that suit me best

Hope Cyberlink will improve the Magic Motion feature!

cheers, Anja

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Mar 17. 2015 14:50

PDR 14.0.4207.0 / Windows 10 64-bit / Asus / Intel i7-4790 3.60 GHz / 16GB RAM / NVIDIA GeForce GTX 970 / DirectX 12

ynotfish

Senior Contributor Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9977 Offline

Mar 18, 2015 02:44

Hi Anja -

Have I been barking up the wrong tree? I've been looking at the shimmering effect (within the photo) when motion is applied to more complex images. Watching your latest batch of tests, it seems like you've been concerned about the *juddering movement of the whole image as it pans or zooms. I mean stop/start rather than smooth gliding motion.

I may have completely misunderstood what you were saying.

Cheers - Tony
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Anja the Dane

Contributor Location: Denmark (North of Copenhagen) Joined: Mar 03, 2011 15:02 Messages: 347 Offline

Mar 18, 2015 10:13

Hi again Tony,

The english language isn't easy

Well - I do not know what YouTube makes to the videos uploaded -?
There is a distinct difference in the m2ts files I uploaded and those on the PC. Those m2ts on PC are much more flickering-shimmering than the copys on YouTube. Stupid I was not aware of this earlier - would have saved a lot of time for all of us.

Therefore I made some new smaller tests with only 3 images and attach them instead of uploading to YouTube - produced in PD11 and PD13.
Hope uploading to CL does not change the original as when uploading to YouTube - plus hope You'll be able to see the difference now.

When comes to jumpy/juddering/shaking, stop/start rather than smooth gliding motion, it can be seen here:
https://youtu.be/JxbTnLbPnyc the last picture.
And its especially in the YT copy "Motion M2TS 1280x720p 16MBps" http://youtu.be/NM4wABGCuf4 ( from 14/03/2015 07:10:28 )
I havn't made a new m2ts test of this.

Cheers, Anja

Filename	flickering-shimmering pd13 AVC 1280x720p 24Mbps HDQ.m2ts	Download
Description	PD13 flickering but sharp
Filesize	35788 Kbytes
Downloaded:	260 time(s)

Filename	flickering-shimmering pd11 AVC 1280x720p 24Mbps HDQ.m2ts	Download
Description	PD11 nearly no flickering but a bit unsharp
Filesize	35448 Kbytes
Downloaded:	256 time(s)

PDR 14.0.4207.0 / Windows 10 64-bit / Asus / Intel i7-4790 3.60 GHz / 16GB RAM / NVIDIA GeForce GTX 970 / DirectX 12

ynotfish

Senior Contributor Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9977 Offline

Mar 18, 2015 14:28

Sorry Anna -

I was forgetting that English isn't your first language. When I said "barking up the wrong tree" it means "on the wrong track", "going the wrong way", "making the wrong choice".

It seems like I wasn't anyway.

Your posted samples show the problem very well. Two slideshow videos, identical in nearly every respect (Media Info) BUT quite different to view. PDR11 produced the video with barely any shimmering. PDR13 didn't! By removing the YouTube variable, the issue is easier to see.

YouTube has recommended settings for upload - https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/1722171?hl=en-GB

Cheers - Tony
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Anja the Dane

Contributor Location: Denmark (North of Copenhagen) Joined: Mar 03, 2011 15:02 Messages: 347 Offline

Mar 21, 2015 07:53

Don't be sory Tony

I'm just pleased that I finally got around to post examples that clearly shows the problem.

I do hope that CL will fix this flickering problem - the sooner the better.

And it would be very nice if there is a way to let PD11 do the rendering until the flickering problem is solved/fixed in PD13.

Thanks for the YouTube link, havn't seen this side before but was aware that when making a project in 16:9 one shall choose 1280x720 when render and upload.
I wonder why PowerDirector in Produce-Online-YouTube have only WMV profiles when YouTube suports other fileformats too?

Cheers, Anja PDR 14.0.4207.0 / Windows 10 64-bit / Asus / Intel i7-4790 3.60 GHz / 16GB RAM / NVIDIA GeForce GTX 970 / DirectX 12

AlS

Senior Member Location: South Africa Joined: Sep 23, 2014 18:07 Messages: 290 Offline

Mar 24, 2015 05:03

Quote: This is a genuine problem. I have the same shimmering results with a Motion Slide Show - especially with water shots. Very annoying - hope they fix it.
Thanks for all the tests.

Quick update. Flickering was terrible when I created a normal DVD but I just created a BluRay from same project and results are much better. Not a fix just a comment.

Also flicker is in water pics with Magic Motion is much worse with vertical motion than horizontal. Power Director 13&14 Ultimate, Photo Director 6, Audio Dir, Pwr2Go 10
Win 10 64, Intel MB DH87MC, Intel i5-4670 CPU @ 3.40GHz, 16Gb DDR3 1600, 128Gb SSD, 2x1Tb WDBlue 7200rpmSATA6, Intel 4600 GPU, Gigabyte G1 GTX960 4GB, LG BluRay Writer