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PD13 2307 H265 decoding hardware acceleration problem . PLAYBACK issue with HEVC on 750 Ti (Maxwell)
Julien Pierre [Avatar]
Contributor Joined: Apr 14, 2011 01:34 Messages: 476 Offline
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I did my first HEVC (H.265) encodings today. Slow - about 1/5th the speed of H.264 .

When I try to play the resulting HEVC clip in PowerDirector, there are a lot of hiccups, and the video stops playing.

If I disable hardware decoding, the clip plays fine.

I'm using a GTX 750 Ti with nVidia drivers 344.65 .

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Nov 20. 2014 21:20

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stevek
Senior Contributor Location: Houston, Texas USA Joined: Jan 25, 2011 12:18 Messages: 4663 Offline
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Do you have an example that I can download and try? I have the same video card and 344.11 driver on a W8.1, 4th gen i7 CPU

I just tried to test with a video I have and the HVAC was much slower -- almost 10 times as slow. I did not let either one complete and I just counted for the time.

I found this article interesting:
http://www.cnet.com/news/what-is-hevc-high-efficiency-video-coding-h-265-and-4k-compression-explained/

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at Nov 15. 2014 09:25

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BoilerPlate: To posters who ask for help -- it is nice to thank the volunteers who try to answer your questions !
Anything I post unless stated with a reference is my personal opinion.
Julien Pierre [Avatar]
Contributor Joined: Apr 14, 2011 01:34 Messages: 476 Offline
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Quote: Do you have an example that I can download and try? I have the same video card and 344.11 driver on a W8.1, 4th gen i7 CPU


Here is a sample. Plays OK with my AMD FX-8350 (OC at 4.6 GHz) if I disable the hardware decoding for my 750 Ti. It uses about 53% CPU in task manager to play back.

I'm using PD13 build 2307 and nVidia drivers 344.65 .

If I turn hardware decoding on, PD craps out right around the time it shows the fireplace, and then shows blocky artifacts and stops.
When using GPU-Z set to update every 0.1sec, I can see the GPU load going to 20-50% briefly for the first couple of seconds, then back down to about 0. CPU usage doesn't go above 12%.

Note that you need to restart PowerDirector 13 when you change the hardware decoding setting.
 Filename
Produce.m2ts
[Disk]
 Description
Clip encoded in H.265 (HEVC) that demonstrates the playback issue.
 Filesize
139416 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
262 time(s)

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at Nov 16. 2014 09:13

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PepsiMan
Senior Contributor Location: Clarksville, TN Joined: Dec 29, 2010 01:20 Messages: 1054 Offline
[Post New]
Julien.

in my setup, it's purrrrfectly smoooooth.
 Filename
20141115_2116_28.mp4
[Disk]
 Description
 Filesize
8565 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
327 time(s)
'no bridge too far'

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Julien Pierre [Avatar]
Contributor Joined: Apr 14, 2011 01:34 Messages: 476 Offline
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PepsiMan,

Quote: Julien.

in my setup, it's purrrrfectly smoooooth.


The playback in your screen capture is not smooth actually, but that may be due to the screen capture tool, or the way you encoded the result. Which tool did you use for the screen capture ? I'd like to make a capture of the result here.

However, you have a GTX 550 Ti GPU . That card does not provide hardware decoding capability for H.265 (HEVC).
So, of course, you will not experience any problem with H.265 hardware decoding - there isn't any for PD to use .
If you go to the "sensors" screen in GPU-Z, you will see as evidence that there is very low GPU usage.
If you check task manager, you will see the CPU usage is very high, because there is no hardware acceleration, and the decoding is being done on your CPU.

I'm using a GTX 750 Ti, which does have H.265 hardware decoding capability . But there is a problem using it in PD13. That could be either an nVidia problem or a PD13 problem. I haven't tried to look for any other H.265 player, and I would need to find one that can take advantage of H.265 hardware decoding.
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6 x 1 TB Samsung 860 SSD (striped)

2 x LG 32UD59-B 32" 4K
Asus PB238 23" HD (portrait)
PepsiMan
Senior Contributor Location: Clarksville, TN Joined: Dec 29, 2010 01:20 Messages: 1054 Offline
[Post New]
actually your set-up and mine are very similar, except I didn't OC my CPU.
screen capture program is called CamStudio 272 r 326.
yes, video was captured at 24FPS.

on the other hand you do have the Shadow Play which you can use for screen capture.
it's in the GeForce experience.

here's my earlier comp. set-up. yes I do have GTX 750Ti. someone gave it to me for 100 peanuts!
what I mean is I gave 100 peanuts for factory refurbished GTX 750Ti...
some lucky ones got it for 99 peanuts.

I do not have any hardware acceleration at all. it says but I don't think so.

http://forum.cyberlink.com/forum/posts/list/40607.page

look at the one says tooooooooooooo painful.
and this one...

http://forum.cyberlink.com/forum/posts/list/41169.page

I used trial version of div x converter to encode h.264 .mp4 files to h.265 .mkv and it was alright.
700MB file was shrunk to 90MB... noisy, too.

http://divx.force.com/apex/Show_DivxB2C_Article?id=kA1400000004NDg&language=en_US&url=How-do-I-enable-disable-hardware-acceleration-in-the-DivX-Converter

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at Nov 16. 2014 03:28

'no bridge too far'

Yashica Electro 8 LD-6 Super 8mm
Asrock TaiChi X470, AMD R7 2700X, W7P 64, MSI GTX1060 6GB, Corsair 16GB/RAM
Dell XPS L702X i7-2860QM, W7P / W10P 64, Intel HD3000/nVidia GT 550M 1GB, Micron 16GB/RAM
Samsung Galaxy Note3/NX1
Julien Pierre [Avatar]
Contributor Joined: Apr 14, 2011 01:34 Messages: 476 Offline
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Quote: actually your set-up and mine are very similar, except I didn't OC my CPU.


Your capture clearly shows in GPU-Z that you have a 550 Ti GPU, not a 750 Ti GPU .

Do you have multiple GPUs ?


screen capture program is called CamStudio 272 r 326.


Thanks, I will try that.


yes, video was captured at 24FPS.


That explains it.


on the other hand you do have the Shadow Play which you can use for screen capture.
it's in the GeForce experience.


I don't install Geforce experience due to the unscheduled automatic driver updates which I don't want.

http://forum.cyberlink.com/forum/posts/list/40607.page

look at the one says tooooooooooooo painful.
and this one...

http://forum.cyberlink.com/forum/posts/list/41169.page


These threads are about hardware acceleration for encoding.
This one is about hardware decoding, ie. a playback issue.
They are separate problems.


I used trial version of div x converter to encode h.264 .mp4 files to h.265 .mkv and it was alrigh
700MB file was shrunk to 90MB... noisy, too.


I tried that, but I didn't have any luck with Divx software. The Divx player can't play the H.265 file I attached in this thread, even with the HEVC plug-in installed.



I tried that, but the Divx converter isn't showing this hardware acceleration option on my system.
I think it's probably because I'm using the 344.65 drivers which removed the CUDA encoder, NVCUVENC.
Divx converter is probably using this deprecated CUDA encoder. It must not have been updated yet to use NVENC on nVidia Kepler/Maxwell.

In any case, my issue is with playback here, not encoding.
The only GPUs that can do H.265 hardware encoding are Maxwell 2 - ie. the GTX 970/980 , which I don't have.
And that is only a hardware capability. I don't think the software stack supports it yet.
nVidia probably still needs to update the NVENC APIs to expose H.265, and then Cyberlink would need to use it in PowerDirector.

If I had to guess, this will work in PowerDirector 14 or 15, around the time the nVidia GTX 1000 or 1100 series will ship .

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Nov 16. 2014 08:21

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6 x 1 TB Samsung 860 SSD (striped)

2 x LG 32UD59-B 32" 4K
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stevek
Senior Contributor Location: Houston, Texas USA Joined: Jan 25, 2011 12:18 Messages: 4663 Offline
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I'm glad that PepsiMan is providing helpful information.

I donwlaod the video and produced it to HEVC mp4 format both with hardware acceleration on and off. Surprisingly both took about 2:15 to encode and both used about 90% CPU.

They both played without hiccups but the software encode looked better. I expected that from past experience. The wood floor looked more uniform. With the hardware encode, there were shading patches.

I'm not sure I can add anything more. .
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BoilerPlate: To posters who ask for help -- it is nice to thank the volunteers who try to answer your questions !
Anything I post unless stated with a reference is my personal opinion.
Julien Pierre [Avatar]
Contributor Joined: Apr 14, 2011 01:34 Messages: 476 Offline
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FYI, screen capture of the result done with Camstudio when playing back the H.265 file with hardware decoding enabled.

It's a 4K encode because my screen is 2560x1600 .

It also has CPU-Z, GPU-Z and task manager.

Without hardware decoding, all this fine.
 Filename
capture.m2ts
[Disk]
 Description
Screen capture showing the playback issue with the previous clip.
 Filesize
28254 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
245 time(s)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Nov 16. 2014 08:20

MSI X99A Raider
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6 x 1 TB Samsung 860 SSD (striped)

2 x LG 32UD59-B 32" 4K
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Julien Pierre [Avatar]
Contributor Joined: Apr 14, 2011 01:34 Messages: 476 Offline
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stevek,

Quote: I'm glad that PepsiMan is providing helpful information.

I donwlaod the video and produced it to HEVC mp4 format both with hardware acceleration on and off. Surprisingly both took about 2:15 to encode and both used about 90% CPU.

They both played without hiccups but the software encode looked better. I expected that from past experience. The wood floor looked more uniform. With the hardware encode, there were shading patches.

I'm not sure I can add anything more.


The video I attached is already in HEVC format. You didn't need to re-encode it.
This thread is about an issue with playback of the HEVC, not about encoding. I have edited the thread subject to make that clear.

The issue won't show unless your GPU has H.265 decoding capability, like the GTX 750 Ti. You also need nVidia drivers that support it. I am using the latest nVidia drivers 344.65 .

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at Nov 16. 2014 08:19

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Intel i7-5820k @ 4.4 GHz
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Gigabyte nVidia GTX 960 4GB
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stevek
Senior Contributor Location: Houston, Texas USA Joined: Jan 25, 2011 12:18 Messages: 4663 Offline
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Which video file? The last one at 4:27 this morning was the only one that show me the problem.

In that case, perhaps it would have been better placed in PowerDVD rather then the PowerDirector part of the forum.

I had already mentioned that I was using 344.11 so the later driver seems to be the issue. .
.
BoilerPlate: To posters who ask for help -- it is nice to thank the volunteers who try to answer your questions !
Anything I post unless stated with a reference is my personal opinion.
Julien Pierre [Avatar]
Contributor Joined: Apr 14, 2011 01:34 Messages: 476 Offline
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Quote: Which video file? The last one at 4:27 this morning was the only one that show me the problem.


The first one, in the 3rd post on top of this thread.


In that case, perhaps it would have been better placed in PowerDVD rather then the PowerDirector part of the forum.


I'm having a problem with PowerDirector, so I'm posting in the PowerDirector forum.
PowerDirector includes a media player, which claims to support H.265 .
That media player certainly should be able to playback the H.265 files that were encoded by PowerDirector itself.

I had already mentioned that I was using 344.11 so the later driver seems to be the issue.


Sorry, I had missed that. I will download and try 344.11 .
Are you also using the latest PowerDirector 13 build 2307 ?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Nov 16. 2014 09:11

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Gigabyte nVidia GTX 960 4GB
480 GB Patriot Ignite SSD (boot)
2 x 480 GB Sandisk Ultra II SSD (striped)
6 x 1 TB Samsung 860 SSD (striped)

2 x LG 32UD59-B 32" 4K
Asus PB238 23" HD (portrait)
stevek
Senior Contributor Location: Houston, Texas USA Joined: Jan 25, 2011 12:18 Messages: 4663 Offline
[Post New]
Build 2123.

I missed that last update - perhaps it is a good thing! .
.
BoilerPlate: To posters who ask for help -- it is nice to thank the volunteers who try to answer your questions !
Anything I post unless stated with a reference is my personal opinion.
[Post New]
Quote:
Here is a sample.


I don't have 13 anymore, but It plays with MPC having a 18% GPU utilization on a Fermi card. That with reduced GPU frequency (1/2)...

BTW, I have your cat's brother in my household - same coloring, just less fat. It even moves the tail constantly like yours
[Thumb - GPU 18.PNG]
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GPU 18.PNG
[Disk]
 Description
 Filesize
764 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
157 time(s)

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at Nov 16. 2014 09:50

Julien Pierre [Avatar]
Contributor Joined: Apr 14, 2011 01:34 Messages: 476 Offline
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Quote: Build 2123.

I missed that last update - perhaps it is a good thing!


I just reverted to build 2123. The file plays fine.
However, the CPU usage is very high, and GPU usage is very low, even with hardware decoding enabled.
This leads me to believe that PD13 build 2307 added support for H.265 hardware decoding with Maxwell, but it is buggy.

FYI, I did not backlevel my nVidia drivers. I think the latest drivers are OK.
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2 x 480 GB Sandisk Ultra II SSD (striped)
6 x 1 TB Samsung 860 SSD (striped)

2 x LG 32UD59-B 32" 4K
Asus PB238 23" HD (portrait)
Julien Pierre [Avatar]
Contributor Joined: Apr 14, 2011 01:34 Messages: 476 Offline
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Quote:
Quote:
Here is a sample.


I don't have 13 anymore, but It plays with MPC having a 18% GPU utilization on a Fermi card. That with reduced GPU frequency (1/2)...


What's MPC ? Does it have a setting to enable/disable hardware acceleration ? If so, can you check if the GPU usage varies ?

My two 560 Ti Fermi cards are sitting on my desk right now. Don't really feel like plugging them back in this computer just to try.

They will likely end up in another computer of mine that currently has the very old 8600 GT / 9800 GT in them, which are no longer supported by nVidia. Hopefully I can find a buyer. I will do this hardware swap another day/night.


BTW, I have your cat's brother in my household - same coloring, just less fat. It even moves the tail constantly like yours


Nice. How old is yours ? Mine is a 13 year old male. He is extremely friendly, I have had him since he was a kitten.
Despite his weight he still jumps around the sinks and countertops pretty good. He just loves to drink directly from the faucets.
He is not afraid of water.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Nov 16. 2014 10:12

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2 x LG 32UD59-B 32" 4K
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[Post New]
MPC-HC Media Player Classic Home Cinema: http://mpc-hc.org/
It has options to deactivate hardware or select between CUVID and DXVA2.



OT: My cat was abandoned, last summer it came in evenings at our door, hungry, and... we adopted him. It' probably 2 years old, a little skittish, but nice.
Has an embedded chip, but the previous owner didn't want to talk with us (on the phone) about it, it hanged up.
[Thumb - cat.jpg]
 Filename
cat.jpg
[Disk]
 Description
 Filesize
250 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
198 time(s)
[Thumb - MPC-HC.PNG]
 Filename
MPC-HC.PNG
[Disk]
 Description
 Filesize
75 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
3089 time(s)

This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at Nov 16. 2014 12:24

PepsiMan
Senior Contributor Location: Clarksville, TN Joined: Dec 29, 2010 01:20 Messages: 1054 Offline
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In any case, my issue is with playback here, not encoding.
The only GPUs that can do H.265 hardware encoding are Maxwell 2 - ie. the GTX 970/980 , which I don't have.
And that is only a hardware capability. I don't think the software stack supports it yet.
nVidia probably still needs to update the NVENC APIs to expose H.265, and then Cyberlink would need to use it in PowerDirector.

If I had to guess, this will work in PowerDirector 14 or 15, around the time the nVidia GTX 1000 or 1100 series will ship .


Bullseye, Julien!
yes, it's the GTX 750Ti rather PD13. PD13 doesn't like it. PD13 doesn't like PD10 either.

I have also GTX 550Ti, GTX 650, 9800GT, etc (so much for upgrading).

I am too, desperately trying to work things out but...
(codecs that are installed in my comp.
DivX 10.2.3, Quick Time 7.7.6, VLC 2.1.4 Rincewind, Xvid 1.3.3, FFDshow_r4533_20140929_clsid_x64)

(players that are installed in my comp. MPC stands for media player classic you get with K-lite codec pack but mine is MPC-HomeCinema x64 1.7.6.217, VLC 2.1.4 Rincewind, WinAmp 5.65(x86), DivX 10.2.3, Quick Time 7.7.6, & CamStudio Player 2.0)

if you install back to GTX 560Ti, your rendered H.265 file should play without any hick-ups...

I do 1080FHD 30P/60P and 4K QHD 30P. PD12 Ultimate Suite does it better for me.
'4K is Awesome! and I agree whole heartedly Eugen157'
for little bit over a year, I've been using PD10 Ultra to create 4K QHD videos with modified Profile.ini for crying out loud!

I want H.265 HEVC. Cyberlink fix it! (I got 21 days left).

as I am typing this thread, I've gone back to GTX 650 with 337.88 & PD13 2307 but...
here's an another candy for ya.
p.s.
customer service told me to clean out my temp folders so it wont crash??? really???
[Thumb - 2014-11-13_103235.jpg]
 Filename
2014-11-13_103235.jpg
[Disk]
 Description
event viewer modul that failed
 Filesize
235 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
163 time(s)
[Thumb - 2014-11-12_172508.jpg]
 Filename
2014-11-12_172508.jpg
[Disk]
 Description
PDR13.exe stopped working rendering 4K H.265 HEVC
 Filesize
391 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
178 time(s)

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at Nov 16. 2014 13:35

'no bridge too far'

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Julien Pierre [Avatar]
Contributor Joined: Apr 14, 2011 01:34 Messages: 476 Offline
[Post New]
Quote: MPC-HC Media Player Classic Home Cinema: http://mpc-hc.org/
It has options to deactivate hardware or select between CUVID and DXVA2.





Thanks !

I tried it. Indeed, CUVID hardware acceleration is available. When I select it, the GPU usage shoots up to about 50 - 60% on the 750 Ti.
The playback "sort of" works. At least it doesn't hang like it does in PD13. But the picture is very bad, and full of blocky artifacts, and colors are all wrong. I have attached a short screen capture.

Given that this hardware decoding doesn't work correctly in m multiple applications, I think it's fairly likely that nVidia bears at least some blame here. But I don't know which APIs MPC and PowerDirector are using.

When disabling hardware acceleration in MPC, the clip plays correctly. CPU usage is about 20%. GPU usage is about 10-15%, which surprises me. My guess is that this usage must be mainly from copying the data into the video memory buffer, not from decompressing the video on the GPU.

If I use DXVA2 (the original default), the CPU and GPU usage are the same as when using no hardware acceleration, so I guess DXVA2 doesn't support HEVC on the 750 Ti.


OT: My cat was abandoned, last summer it came in evenings at our door, hungry, and... we adopted him. It' probably 2 years old, a little skittish, but nice.


Very cute, and he really looks the same as Guybrush.
 Filename
mpc.m2ts
[Disk]
 Description
Capture of playback in MPC with CUVID
 Filesize
29443 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
242 time(s)

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Nov 17. 2014 23:03

MSI X99A Raider
Intel i7-5820k @ 4.4 GHz
32GB DDR4 RAM
Gigabyte nVidia GTX 960 4GB
480 GB Patriot Ignite SSD (boot)
2 x 480 GB Sandisk Ultra II SSD (striped)
6 x 1 TB Samsung 860 SSD (striped)

2 x LG 32UD59-B 32" 4K
Asus PB238 23" HD (portrait)
Julien Pierre [Avatar]
Contributor Joined: Apr 14, 2011 01:34 Messages: 476 Offline
[Post New]
Pepsi,

Quote:
yes, it's the GTX 750Ti rather PD13. PD13 doesn't like it.


Yes, at least for hardware decoding, there is a problem with PD13 and the 750Ti.
But the encoding works fine in PD13 with GTX 750 Ti with the latest PD13 build and latest nVidia drivers.


PD13 doesn't like PD10 either.


Dafydd gave me a hotfix from Cyberlink for PD10 for this problem - if you PM him, I'm sure he can pass it on.
I don't know if Cyberlink will release another official patch for PD10 that includes this fix.


if you install back to GTX 560Ti, your rendered H.265 file should play without any hick-ups...


I'm sure that's true, but I don't know if it will using the card for decoding itself.
Officially, that card does not support H.265 decoding . This is supposed to be a new feature of Maxwell.

Or maybe not .

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7764/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-750-ti-and-gtx-750-review-maxwell/2

Speaking of video, decoding is also receiving a bit of a lift. Maxwell’s VP video decode block won’t feature full H.265 (HEVC) support, but NVIDIA is telling us that they will offer partial hardware acceleration, relying on a mix of software and hardware to decode H.265.



as I am typing this thread, I've gone back to GTX 650 with 337.88 & PD13 2307 but...
here's an another candy for ya.
p.s.
customer service told me to clean out my temp folders so it wont crash??? really???


Submit a crash dump and tell them to review that dump.
That's what I did, and they were able to fix the PD10/PD13 issue for me in a short time. But of course the test case for that was very simple.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Nov 17. 2014 07:08

MSI X99A Raider
Intel i7-5820k @ 4.4 GHz
32GB DDR4 RAM
Gigabyte nVidia GTX 960 4GB
480 GB Patriot Ignite SSD (boot)
2 x 480 GB Sandisk Ultra II SSD (striped)
6 x 1 TB Samsung 860 SSD (striped)

2 x LG 32UD59-B 32" 4K
Asus PB238 23" HD (portrait)
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