PowerDVD 9 problem: BR video freezing (actually looping)!

Martin

Newbie Joined: Dec 12, 2008 06:09 Messages: 47 Offline

Solved by

Mar 20, 2009 15:26

Hi!

I'm experiencing the following problem with PDVD9: when playing BluRays (ISOs from hard disk), the video sometimes gets "stuck": a couple of frames are repeated in an endless loop (they seem to play backwards and forwards). The audio continues normally. It only seems to occur near chapter marks (e.g. when the chapter number changes), but not when I skip to the chapter. E.g. when I play the disc normally, the freeze occurs when the timeline reaches chapter x. I then need to stop the playback and restart it. When I now skip to chapter x (where it occurred), it will play fine. However, if I rewind a bit (by moving the timeline marker just a bit before the chapter mark), it will again freeze at the same chapter position.

It didn't happen with previous versions of PDVD and it doesn't happen with all ISOs (but with many!). I use Vista SP1 32bit, ATI 4670, Catalyst 9.2. I've also tried Windows 7 x64, Catalyst 9.3 and the problem is the same. An ATI 3450 does not show the problem, but I need the 4670 for 7.1 HDMI sound.

I've now tried an ATI 4350 and it shows the exact same problem! Obviously, all 4xxx cards are affected! Nobody else experiences this problem? That's hard to believe, because it happens on 2 different computers here, with 2 different OSes, 2 different cards. Should not be a software incompatibility issue either, because I tried various driver versions on clean systems.

Regards!

Jørn

Newbie Joined: Mar 06, 2009 16:42 Messages: 2 Offline

Mar 21, 2009 17:56

Same problem. PowerDVD 9, Ati 4350, Horton Hears a Who! (Blu-ray). I will check if the problem relates to dirt on the Blu-ray disc (!), since the same problem occured on both the ISO (Anydvd rip to folder + ImgBurn to create iso) and the disc. I cleaned the disc, and then it played perfectly. Will do a new rip tomorrow.

-JR

Martin

Newbie Joined: Dec 12, 2008 06:09 Messages: 47 Offline

Mar 22, 2009 05:47

I don't think it's the rip, because when I play the m2ts file in the stream folder of the BR directly with PDVD 9, it plays fine. So it must be connected with the chapter handling of PDVD 9, because it only happens at chapter marks (and it doesn't happen with any other PDVD version or other players).

Regards!

Jørn

Newbie Joined: Mar 06, 2009 16:42 Messages: 2 Offline

Mar 22, 2009 18:06

Quote: I don't think it's the rip, because when I play the m2ts file in the stream folder of the BR directly with PDVD 9, it plays fine. So it must be connected with the chapter handling of PDVD 9, because it only happens at chapter marks (and it doesn't happen with any other PDVD version or other players).

Did a new rip, and I can confirm that the problem still occurs... (Horton Hears a Who, between chapter 2 and 3).

-Jorn

Martin

Newbie Joined: Dec 12, 2008 06:09 Messages: 47 Offline

Mar 22, 2009 18:49

Hmm, thanks for confirming this. Unfortunately, this means we're screwed, because Cyberlink doesn't seem to know the problem, and I'm sure they don't actually care, because it only seems to occur with an ATI 4xxx and certain discs. Opening a support ticket with them would only result in the usual "uninstall and reinstall..." standard answer. I'm afraid, PDVD 9 will be useless for people affected by this bug. Maybe PDVD 10 will work in a few months/years ;

Regards!

Laurence

Newbie Joined: Mar 28, 2009 16:43 Messages: 6 Offline

Mar 28, 2009 17:04

I have had exactly the same issues as you with an HD3650, HD4350 and HD4670; the HD3650 is the only adapter that does not exhibit this exact same fault!

Eventually, like you, I realised that the HD3650 was the only card that worked OK, and also like you, I wanted an HDMI connection to my AV receiver for 'full HD' audio. To achieve this I purchased the official ATI DVI-HDMI adapter for the HD4k/HD3k adapters and this works perfectly (grey adapter only - 6140063500G).

For now, my HD4670 (really, IMHO, only slightly superior card) has been installed in my main workstation, so it has not gone to waste, it's just not where I wanted it. To be fair, the HD3650 works pefectly in my HTPC, I have 'full HD' audio through my AV receiver via the lower DVI connector/HDMI adapter and superb quality video (1080i) in to my 5 year old Panasonic 50" plasma.

The moral of this story, for now, is, if you need 'full HD' audio via HDMI and you want to play Blu-ray ISO images then you need to buy an HD3k adapter and the offical ATI DVI-HDMI adapter. FYI, the working HD3k card that I'm using is a 'year old' Sapphire HD3650 512MB GDDR3 (now replaced by a GDDR4 model I think) .

Good luck and do report back here if you find a fix!

Martin

Newbie Joined: Dec 12, 2008 06:09 Messages: 47 Offline

Mar 28, 2009 18:44

Hi Laurence!

Thanks for your answer! However, the 3xxx Radeons only have a 2 channel HDMI audio controller! I need the 4xxx card to get 7.1 sound (LPCM, because I don't like the AC3 or DTS downmixing). Can you check if you get 7.1 sound? I really doubt it, because the specifications of the 3xxx cards clearly state it's only 2 channel. Maybe your AVR distributes the 2 channels to all speakers, but it's most likely no real 7.1!

My solution so far is to use ArcSoft TMT 3. I'm still in the phase of testing, but it does seem to work fine with all discs. It does show audio/video sync issues, but I think I found a solution with ReClock (I tried a million different configurations and settings and finally one seems to work fine - smooth 24p with perfect lip sync).

Regards!

Laurence

Newbie Joined: Mar 28, 2009 16:43 Messages: 6 Offline

Mar 29, 2009 17:23

Hi Martin!

I'm not sure about LPCM, maybe you're right about that; I have not tested that yet but I would like to get it working to hear the difference. What I do know is that I definitely do not get just 2 channel audio from the HD3650, as the specification suggests. I have PDVD9 set to output audio via HDMI with decoding switched off; this is detected by my amp as "DTS" (not DTS-HD) with "Die Hard 4.0" Blu-ray. Also, I do not yet have a 7.1 speaker setup so that's not yet a problem for me, just 5.1 at the moment! Like you, I'm still testing different things and trying to get stuff working exactly as I want it and, as I'm sure you've also found, it's very time consuming!

I have not actually tried my HD4670 card in my HTPC connected to my HDMI capable amp yet (only got it last week); it was just before this that I found exactly where the "video freeze/loop" issue was coming from. That sounds like it should be next on my testing list though, even with the ISO loop issue I'd still like to hear the LPCM soundtrack as it should be heard.

Best regards!

Martin

Newbie Joined: Dec 12, 2008 06:09 Messages: 47 Offline

Apr 02, 2009 06:47

Ahh great! Just downloaded the patch and it says that it cannot be installed (not the right version or no PDVD installed - both is incorrect, of course!) I'm using WIn7 7057 x64 btw.

Another perfect example of Cyberlinks great quality!

Regards!

Laurence

Newbie Joined: Mar 28, 2009 16:43 Messages: 6 Offline

Apr 02, 2009 06:51

So, is it correct to say that only TMT 3.1 supports LPCM output from Blu-ray?

Certainly, PDVD9 does not support this; as you said, it downmixes the LPCM to DTS or DD even when you tell it that you don't want the soundtrack decoded.

Martin

Newbie Joined: Dec 12, 2008 06:09 Messages: 47 Offline

Apr 02, 2009 07:00

I think if you choose "HDMI" and "LPCM output", you'll get LPCM output with PDVD - at least it should, but I'm not sure if the channel mapping bug has been fixed yet (probably not).

TMT 3 works, but has its own problems (like severe lip sync issues with HDMI audio).

In the meantime, I uninstalled PDVD 9 completely, reinstalled it and then applied the patch - this time it worked. Why can't Cyberlink create a proper upgrade installer???

Anyway, the problem with the looping video still persists in v1530, so they didn't fix anything! I really don't understand why such a company still can be in business - probably because of the OEM sales, they must offer their cr*ppy product for a very attractive price to OEMs...

Regards!

Laurence

Newbie Joined: Mar 28, 2009 16:43 Messages: 6 Offline

Apr 09, 2009 10:38

Martin, I have got fed up with PDVD9 now, it absolutely will not output the LPCM soundtrack to my AV receiver properly; it is detected as ProLogic! This means that I am unable to appreciate the DTS HD MA or DD TrueHD soundtracks and that's not acceptible to me, as I'm sure you undertsand!

So, I have downloaded TMT3 but, as you have already pointed out, it has severe lipsync issues 'out of the box' with Blu-ray discs whether real media or ISO images! Surely, its inability to play a Blu-ray disc so that you can actually watch it means that it's not fit for purpose? How do these companies have the cheek to sell this software when it doesn't even work as they describe it; it's laughable (but like you, I'm not laughing

)! I just want a solution that works!

Anyway, can you please explain exactly how you have got TMT3 working "satisfactorily" and correctly outputting the lossless soundtrack via HDMI with lipsync?

Many thanks and best regards, Laurence

Martin

Newbie Joined: Dec 12, 2008 06:09 Messages: 47 Offline

Apr 09, 2009 10:49

Hi Laurence!

Actually, I haven't found any solution to the lip sync problems yet! I was experimenting with TMT 3 and Reclock, HA on and off, but I always get severe lip sync problems. Maybe not using 24Hz but 50 or 60 (together with Reclock) would be the solution - I will try this the next few days. Arcsofts support told me they are working on a fix for the lip sync issues, but looking back at their patches for v2, I doubt that they will really be able to fix it for good.

So currently, there seems to be no way to play BR perfectly with PDVD, TMT or whatever (@24p, ATI card, LPCM over HDMI). It's a pity, really! Maybe the upcoming Slyplayer (see the forum on slysoft.com) will solve the issues, but it's still months away. Till then, I'll continue testing different scenarios and I'll report back here if I succeed. Please also notify me if you happen to find a solution!

Regards!

Martin

Newbie Joined: Dec 12, 2008 06:09 Messages: 47 Offline

Apr 12, 2009 18:00

Hi Laurence!

I think I found the solution!!! I set the ATI card to 50 Hz (yes, really!) and I installed Reclock. This way, I get perfect judder free and smooth video (from BRs and PAL DVDs) and perfect lipsync! I've checked with many BRs already and all played back perfectly - no more lipsync issues! This works with TMT 3 only, because PDVD 9 is not supported by Reclock.

Finally, I will be able to enjoy my BRs!

Regards!

EDIT: it seems to be necessary to set the media speed to "25 Hz" and "Locked". Otherwise, with the "Auto" setting, some movies seem to stutter. With "25 Hz" it looks fine - let's hope it stays that way

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Apr 13. 2009 15:53

Laurence

Newbie Joined: Mar 28, 2009 16:43 Messages: 6 Offline

Apr 15, 2009 05:00

Hi Martin, I'm glad to hear to you now seem to have solution that you're happy with!

Could you please just clarify exactly what you get out of your HTPC now because this is currently still eluding me in my configuration? I have installed ReClock which, as you mentioned, fixes the TMT3/PDVD7 lipsync issue.

Do you now get the lossless 'DD TrueHD' and 'DTS HD MA' soundtrack output properly via HDMI using TMT3 or is this still unattainable on your HTPC? I simply cannot get PDVD7/9 or TMT3 to bitstream these soundtracks via HDMI.

Best regards, Laurence

Martin

Newbie Joined: Dec 12, 2008 06:09 Messages: 47 Offline

Apr 15, 2009 05:08

Bitstreaming is not possible with ATI cards. They will only output 7.1 LPCM, which is pretty good for me. To get bitstreaming, you'd need a special soundcard like the ASUS HDAV Xonar (you'll find much info on this on the AVSForum). But I don't know if the gain in audio quality would be worth $200,-? Furthermore, there are several other problems with that solution, like Reclock not working anymore (and therefore possible lipsync issues again), need to manually change between LPCM and bitstreaming for different sound tracks, 24p issues with older cards that are still being sold, etc.

For me, the downconverted LPCM will have to do until Slysoft releases their player sometime this year. It's supposed to output unmolested LPCM, which should sound as good as bitstreaming without the need of special expensive hardware.

Regards!

Laurence

Newbie Joined: Mar 28, 2009 16:43 Messages: 6 Offline

Apr 15, 2009 06:14

Hi Martin, many thanks for clearing that up! I look forward to seeing what Slysoft offer us later this year then. Thanks again.