Editing AVCHD 1080/60p videos

JackL

Newbie Location: Portland, OR, USA Joined: Dec 11, 2011 20:19 Messages: 11 Offline

Solved by

Dec 21, 2011 14:17

Is PowerDirector 10 capable of editing video material that is recorded in AVCHD 1080/60p? Using this material I only get jerky videos where it looks like a frame or two is lost or skipped randomly every few seconds. Before I used only video material recorded in 720p AVCHD-Lite where I didn't have these problems.

I'm using two cameras with the AVCHD 1080/60p recording format: Sony camera DSC-HX9V (with SanDisk Extreme Pro SDHC card rated at 95MB/s) and Panasonic camcorder HDC-TM90 (with internal memory). I have tested and edited now many shots with both cameras, but every time the result is a jerky video.

I produce two versions of the videos:
1. MPEG-4 custom setting for Apple TV (1st generation): 1280 by 720 pixels at 24 fps, Progressive Main Profile (CAVLC), 6000 kbps
2. PowerDirector 10 standard settings for YouTube with full HD (1920x1080)

Both versions have the jerky video. You can see the YouTube version here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cZcBLnYro0. Just in case I also created a 1280x720 version for YouTube (using PowerDirector 10 standard settings) but it's the same problem: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdnQ6RkuGJg.

To get a decent version of the video for AppleTV I have created a best quality MPEG-4 version (using PowerDirector 10 standard settings) and then run it through HandBrake (version 0.9.4) with the AppleTV presets. This video dosn't have any jerkiness when watched on AppleTV but it's only in the format 960x544. When I change the format to 1280x720 in HandBrake I get again a jerky video.

So, is PowerDirector10 capable of editing 1080/60p AVCHD videos? I understand that the 1080/60p AVCHD format is relatively new, so I wonder if PowerDirector10 is not supporting this format.

I'm looking forward to any tips on how to produce smooth 1080p videos for YouTube and 720p for AppleTV using AVCHD 1080/60p source material.

Here are the details about my system:
1. Which operating system do you use, W7, Vista, XP?
Windows 7 Professional 64-bit

2. Which version of PD
PowerDirector Ultra 10.0.0.1129a
Since my PC supports both OpenGL as well as NVIDIA CUDA, I have enabled both hardware acceleration options in the PowerDirector settings.

3. Which SR number
VDE111019-02

4. What kind of video source material used (codec / container), extension?
AVCHD 1080/60p from Sony camera DSC-HX9V (with SanDisk Extreme Pro SDHC card rated at 95MB/s) and Panasonic camcorder HDC-TM90 (with internal memory)

5. A detailed step by step description of the problem
see description above

6. What anti-virus solution is installed on your PC?
Norton Internet Security 2012

7. What codec packs installed? See PD's Readme html file
I couldn't find the Readme file, but initially I didn't have any special codecs installed. I just installed the DivX codec but there is no change with the jerky videos.

8. What other video editing programs are installed - just in case there is a software conflict.
none

9. What burning software is installed on your PC?
Nero 7 Essentials, which came with the PC, but I never used it

10. What type of blank disk was used, if you have a burning create issue?
I'm not burning

11. What background processes / programs running (especially important for problems with the burning)?
Windows Explorer, Firefox, and iTunes, but I have the same problem when these programs are not running

12. Provide the dxdiag log file as an attachment, see Part B below
see attached

Filename	JackLDxDiag.txt	Download
Description
Filesize	36 Kbytes
Downloaded:	338 time(s)

Filename	64JackLDxDiag.txt	Download
Description
Filesize	37 Kbytes
Downloaded:	331 time(s)

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Dec 21. 2011 16:29

Berto2002

Member Location: Southend-on-Sea, UK Joined: May 23, 2010 04:16 Messages: 74 Offline

Dec 21, 2011 15:09

I am using a similar source to you.
Does this also describe your issue?
http://forum.cyberlink.com/forum/posts/list/20616.page AMD Phenom II X6 1100XT
ASUS M4A89GTD Pro/USB m/board
8GB Corsair Performance RAM
128GB OCX SATA-III SSD / 2TB SATA-III HDD
ASUS GeForce GTX 760 2048MB
LG blu-ray RW super drive
Windows 10 Home Premium 64-bit
PowerDirector Ultra 13

JackL

Newbie Location: Portland, OR, USA Joined: Dec 11, 2011 20:19 Messages: 11 Offline

Dec 21, 2011 16:04

Hi Berto2002.

You and I may have the same problem. Although I don't have much sound on the videos I have tested and hence cannot test the out-of-sync between video and audio, the clips skip a lot when playing from the timeline and the video is very grainy. But my clips skip also when played from the media room, although the video quality is full HD when played from the media room.

Regards,
Jack

FredB

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 15, 2008 21:14 Messages: 1317 Offline

Dec 21, 2011 17:48

JackL;

I suggest the following:

1. Update your video drivers directly from the Nvidia.com site. Yours are more than a year old.

2. You might try turning OFF hardware Acceleration in "Preferences"

3. Change the settings for the resolution in the preview window..there is an icon under the preview window for this.

EDIT: Make sure you are moving the files to the INTERNAL drive....do not attempt to use the files directly on the SD Card.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Dec 21. 2011 17:54

JackL

Newbie Location: Portland, OR, USA Joined: Dec 11, 2011 20:19 Messages: 11 Offline

Dec 21, 2011 20:29

Thanks, FredB. Unfortunately, your recommendations helped only with the jerkiness and skipped frames within PowerDirector.

I have updated the video drivers directly from Nvidia, turned off HW acceleration (both OpenCL and decoding), and changed the settings in the preview window to full HD. Now when I play clips in the Edit mode, whether from the timeline or from the media room, they are played in the full HD resolution and don't skip.

However, the rendered video for AppleTV and for YouTube is still jerky and skips frames. The video for YouTube, which was created without the HW acceleration is here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCP22KsvBCY. I tried also to disable the fast video rendering technology, which is the HW video encoder for MPEG-4 videos, when producing the video for AppleTV, but it leads to the same jerkiness.

Do you have any other ideas on how to eliminate the jerkiness of the videos? Should I count on PowerDirector to render the AVCHD 1080/60p videos in the formats I need?

By the way, I always copy the videos from the camera to the internal drive using Windows' "Import pictures and videos".

Regards,
Jack

FredB

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 15, 2008 21:14 Messages: 1317 Offline

Dec 21, 2011 20:39

Have you tried publishing to youtube DIRECTLY from inside PD10 as 1920x1080?
This sounds like an issue with the profile used for production. the Apple profile is 1280x720 and this re-rendering may be causing some of this. Others here have more experience with this issue than I do, so let's see if they jump in.

JackL

Newbie Location: Portland, OR, USA Joined: Dec 11, 2011 20:19 Messages: 11 Offline

Dec 21, 2011 20:53

Hi FredB.

Yes, I have published to YouTube directly from inside PD10 as 1920x1080 using the Full HD standard setting. As I mentioned in the original post, I render the video twice: once for AppleTV and once for YouTube. In other words, the video uploaded to YouTube is not re-rendered, it is uploaded straight from PD10.

Regards,
Jack

FredB

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 15, 2008 21:14 Messages: 1317 Offline

Dec 21, 2011 20:59

The next thing that the editors here will ask you for is a short (no more than 5 second long), native clip from the camera. this helps to reproduce the issue.

Since this is a global forum, some of your best resources may be sleeping now, so, please post the short clips for us.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Dec 21. 2011 20:59

JackL

Newbie Location: Portland, OR, USA Joined: Dec 11, 2011 20:19 Messages: 11 Offline

Dec 21, 2011 21:35

Thanks, FredB. Unfortunately, I don't have a short clip handy, so I have uploaded a 35s clip, which was also the source for the video posted on YouTube. It's 106MB, so if this is too long and too big I can record a shorter clip tomorrow during day light (it's evening and dark now here where I am).

Regards,
Jack

Filename	00077.MTS	Download
Description
Filesize	109374 Kbytes
Downloaded:	360 time(s)

Xerox

Contributor Location: California, USA Joined: Aug 09, 2009 01:36 Messages: 446 Offline

Dec 22, 2011 01:52

I downloaded Berto2002's 1080p 60fps video and got it to play smoothly by turning on the "Enable HD Video Processing (Shadow Files) option in preferences. That creates a proxy file that will play back smoothly.

If a clip is already on the timeline and then you turn on the "Enable HD Video Processing" option, the proxy file won't be used until you reload your project, or you could drag the clip from the media room down to the timeline again to overwrite the existing instance. So wait for the green filmstrip icon to show up on the clip's thumbnail in the media room. That means it's ready. Gateway DX4380, AMD A8-5500 Quad Core 3.2GHz with ATI Radeon HD 7560D; 16GB RAM; 1 TB SATA 7200 RPM; Windows 8 Pro 64-bit; PDR11, PDVD12.

JackL

Newbie Location: Portland, OR, USA Joined: Dec 11, 2011 20:19 Messages: 11 Offline

Dec 22, 2011 03:05

Hi Xerox.

You probably meant that you downloaded my file, not Berto2002's. But anyway, I always have ""Enable HD video processing (shadow file)" turned on. And playing the clips smoothly on the timeline or from the media room is no longer an issue after I have turned off HW acceleration (both OpenCL and decoding).

What is still an issue is the rendered video for AppleTV and for YouTube, which is still jerky and skips frames.

Regards,
Jack

Dafydd B

Senior Contributor Joined: Aug 26, 2006 08:20 Messages: 11973 Offline

Dec 22, 2011 04:19

Hi,
To provide a sample video of 5 seconds - point and shoot the camera at "anything" and then upload the video. 35seconds creates too big a file for members to want to download.

1. MPEG-4 custom setting for Apple TV (1st generation): 1280 by 720 pixels at 24 fps, Progressive Main Profile (CAVLC), 6000 kbps

Please alter your Template Profile to 30fps and not 24fps. see if that helps.

My suggestion is because....Reasoning: 24fps = an uneven number of frames to be dropped whereas 30fps = a simple every other frame drop. Personally I would never choose 24fps as a render to rate for a Produced file. A streamed file can have an altered frame rate even further, say to 15fps as a means to space and size save. The lessoning numbers in the frame rate will eventually show up as a jerky movie especially if there is a lot of fast movement. 24fps is also used elsewhere.... it's not suitable for streamed video in my opinion in this instance.

Dafydd

FredB

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 15, 2008 21:14 Messages: 1317 Offline

Dec 22, 2011 09:49

JackL;
Xerox would NEED "shadow files" as his machine is not strong. YOURS, on the other hand is very adequate (although the GTX 2xx series video card is not the strongest and has it's own issues) and I would suggest that you may not need shadow files.

On his platform, shadow files would help playback, as he is short RAM.

Try turning them OFF, as they insert their own delays and jerkiness if they are still being created when you produce or edit.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Dec 22. 2011 09:52

JackL

Newbie Location: Portland, OR, USA Joined: Dec 11, 2011 20:19 Messages: 11 Offline

Dec 22, 2011 12:30

Dafydd,

I have uploaded a shorter source file.

As for the 24fps profile, I need this for the AppleTV version of the video. Below are Apple's requirements for the AppleTV (1st generation). You can find them here as well: http://support.apple.com/kb/SP19. Just to check it, I changed the profile to 30fps, but as expected, iTunes, which acts as conduit to AppleTV, doesn't copy the video to AppleTV since it "cannot be played on this AppleTV".
H.264
Up to 5 Mbps
Progressive Main Profile (CAVLC)
maximum resolution: 1280 by 720 pixels at 24 fps
AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps
.m4v, .mp4, and .mov file formats

Also, please keep in mind that I render two different versions of the video:
1. one for AppleTV (720p, 24fps) and
2. one for YouTube (Full HD, uploaded directly within PD, I don't know exactly what settings PD is using, but the file created by PD is a wmv file with 1920x1080 resolution at 29 fps, with a data rate of 10Mbps).

FredB,

I turned off "Enable HD video processing (shadow file)" and created a new YouTube video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STZ8XevvE8Q. As you can see, there is no difference, the video is still jerky and drops frames.

Regards,
Jack

Filename	00083.MTS	Download
Description
Filesize	23004 Kbytes
Downloaded:	369 time(s)

FredB

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 15, 2008 21:14 Messages: 1317 Offline

Dec 22, 2011 12:43

I will downoad and look at the video. 23MB is still large for many, but some will try it.

Just a quick suggestion for links posted here. DO NOT place a period directly after the links, in Firefox, it awakens the "team of monkeys" on youtube (click your link above) and make the other links fail. Put a space before the period.

FredB

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 15, 2008 21:14 Messages: 1317 Offline

Dec 22, 2011 13:17

JackL;

Your clip acted the same way on my system and the youtube production contained the "skips".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fKVD2R7VgeI

This issue may be the bitrate/fps of the clip (see attached). I have a Canon hf11 and I have never been able to get PD (10 or 9) to handle the MXP = 24Mbps, 60fps clips without the delays you see. I tried all kinds of profile settings (in the past), and simply gave up.

I have recently obtained a firmware update for the camera that lets me record to Class 10 SDHC cards, and once I get the card (later today), I will try again to see if possibly this Firmware update (and the faster card) has made a difference. Even though the clip plays fine in the library, I can't be sure some skips aren't included in the file until I create my own.

Filename	Untitled-2.png	Download
Description
Filesize	42 Kbytes
Downloaded:	303 time(s)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Dec 22. 2011 13:20

JackL

Newbie Location: Portland, OR, USA Joined: Dec 11, 2011 20:19 Messages: 11 Offline

Dec 22, 2011 13:39

Hi FredB.

Sorry about the link. I'm going to watch for the monkeys. ;

The file is only 6 seconds long, but since it's 1080p60, it's 27 Mbps. With the AVHCD compression it ends up being then "only" 22.4MB.

EDIT (didn't see your second message before):

My video is recorded to the internal memory of the Panasonic camcorder, so the write speed shouldn't be an issue.

Are you saying that PD10 is not able to render 60fps videos? Are you aware of any other video editing software that can handle it?

Regards,
Jack

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Dec 22. 2011 13:47

pjc3

Senior Member Location: Australia Joined: May 29, 2010 19:33 Messages: 247 Offline

Dec 22, 2011 14:58

Hi JackL,
I've been reading your thread for a bit and thought I had better jump in. I am a PD9 user.

I have SD600 & TM700 which produce same files as your TM90. Powerdirector is fine for editing these files and one of the few NLEs which can output full 1080p60 @ > 30Mbps. Sony has a good editing product which I own, but fall back to PD most of the time.

I agree with Dafydd that your problem probably comes from frame rate conversion, although I am at a loss why the UTube upload also has the problem.

One suggestion I will make (and I am pretty sure you won't like it

) is to ditch the Apple TV and get a WDTV instead (I am a MAC user as well!). This way you can render to 1080p60 at 28Mbps and enjoy the full benefits of the two cameras you have.

ps forgot to mention: try rendering 1080p to HDD first then uploading to UTube from your own account (NOT within PD) and see if that makes a difference.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Dec 22. 2011 15:00

Panasonic SD9, Panasonic TM700, Panasonic SD600, GoPro HD Hero.

FredB

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 15, 2008 21:14 Messages: 1317 Offline

Dec 22, 2011 15:00

pjc3..can you publish his clip to youtube without pauses?

JackL

Newbie Location: Portland, OR, USA Joined: Dec 11, 2011 20:19 Messages: 11 Offline

Dec 22, 2011 15:43

Hi pjc3.

I'm not a Mac user but I use iTunes, so AppleTV is perfect for me. I also don't want to need to keep the PC on for streaming, hence WDTV won't work for me.

I tried to output first to the HD before uploading to YouTube, but no luck. I have created a MPEG-4, 1080p with 30fps (following the profile recommendations from YouTube: http://support.google.com/youtube/bin/static.py?hl=en&topic=1728573&guide=1728585&page=guide.cs ) and then uploaded to YouTube manually. There is still, however, the jerkiness and skipping: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmKuyL9hx9E

How do you create videos for YouTube from your 1080p60 material? If you don't output to YouTube, what format do you produce your videos in?

And can you create a skipping-free video from the file I have uploaded?

Regards,
Jack

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Dec 22. 2011 19:19