Hi Jerry
You tried to reload from saved project, automatically by the PD.
Unless you have manually deleted it is stored 30days.
As your project seems to be great, must have saved several files PDS.
By the time you get there.
I do it sometimes crashes and PD before I save the project. AMD-FX 8350 / 8GB DDR3
SSD SUV400S37240G / 2-HD WD 1TB
AMD Radeon R9 270 / AOC M2470SWD
Windows 7-64 / PD16 Ultimate

Quote: Hi Jerry
You tried to reload from saved project, automatically by the PD.
Unless you have manually deleted it is stored 30days.
As your project seems to be great, must have saved several files PDS.
By the time you get there.
I do it sometimes crashes and PD before I save the project.

It doesn't matter much. I started over (not quite from scratch, since I was editing in a linear fashion and all my work was to the left of the problem).

I've also figured out how to duplicate the problem, and attached a "tutorial". Jerry Schwartz

hi jerrys,

I have looked at your tutorial, which undertakes to restate the problem you have experienced. If your tutorial actually restates the problem as you originally experienced it, then I suggest you have no problem at all, PD9 performed in the way it is supposed to. The gap which you see is not created at the time of insertion. It merely remains as the same gap which was there when you inserted the audio back into the timeline. The inserted clip will be to the left of the gap. Insertion does not remove the blank space (gap), the overwrite command does do so.

If you want to retain all of the original audio, it can be left down below, where you moved it, or it can be returned to the place from which you removed it. Either way, you will have all of the audio playing in the finished product. The freeze frame in the video can easily be adjusted to the appropriate length, so it will sync with the length of the audio.

Actually, you do not even need to mess with original track (track 1), if you simply place the freeze framed video in a lower track, to play precisely below where you wanted to insert it in track 1. This is easily done by use of the blue scrubber line. In that event, the freeze framed video will play to the exclusion of the video in track 1 and the audio will continue to play unaltered.

If you want to overwrite audio, merely placing the new audio in a lower track will not block the audio above it. Both tracks will play at the same time. In that case, you will have to delete the unwanted audio segment in track 1, but you need not insert the new audio in track 1. It will work just fine in any lower track.

Please do not be insulted by my plebeian explanation, I am just trying to be clear. I realize you are an experienced editer and I respect that. I am just trying to contribute to a resolution of the perceived problem. You can help me next time. The key to the whole thing, if I have stated a resolution of the problem, is in realizing that the gap is not new. It is simply the gap that was created when you modified only one part of track 1 and was merely moved, not removed, when you inserted new material.

I hope this does help some. If not, could you post a short clip of the actual footage which was the problem?

Thanks,

Pax Laptop PC, ASUS
Core i7 Q 720
Win 7, 64-bit
RAM 8GB DDR2
Graphics, NVIDIA GeForce GTS 360M 1GB DDR5

Pax 123, you make some excellent points. I hadn't thought about it the way you did, and you are absolutely right: inserting that audio clip does in fact insert the clip exactly where you drop it, and it doesn't matter if that is a clip or a gap. Everything to the right of the clip you insert is pushed to the right. The same thing happens with a video clip, by the way.

So thanks for your perspective.

Now, on with my thoughts.

Clearly, this was a designer's choice (or they painted themselves into a corner and couldn't easily fix it). "It's not a bug, it's a feature", as we developers say.

However, that raises some questions in my mind:

If the "right" way to do this is to unlink the audio and move it down to another track, why isn't there an easy way to do this with multiple clips?

Why does this happen with a clip that is already on the timeline, but not with a clip that you drag in from the media room? That is an important inconsistency.

Why is it possible to desynchronize two linked objects at all? Conversely, how can one keep it from happening? I know you pointed out some other ways to do what I wanted, but this was a surprise. Programs should not surprise users, unless you can win additional lives and rescue the princess.

Similarly, if you group objects on different tracks they normally move together; but this is an exception. They will get out of synch just as they would if they were on the same track. I could understand why it might work this way on a pair of coupled tracks (#1 video and #1 audio), but not on separate tracks. Some technique ought to allow you to keep the relative position of two chunks of material fixed relative to each other, regardless of insertions or deletions.

If inserting a clip creates this desynchronization by inserting a chunk of time in only the video or audio "half" of a track, why doesn't deleting that clip do the opposite?

If this is in fact a feature that adds flexibility, then why can't you insert, or set the duration, of a gap? That would be handy if you wanted to slip the sound relative to the the video, and it would affect everything to the right -- something that is not easy to do.

Likewise, you ought to be able to remove a gap.

Well, that's enough for one day.

Thanks for tuning in to JRC -- the Jerry Rant Channel. Jerry Schwartz

Jerry Jerry Jerry HP Envy Phoenix/4thGen i7-4770(4@3.4GHz~turbo>3.9)
Nvidia GTX 960(4GB)/16GB DDR3/
Canon Vixia HV30/HF-M40/HF-M41/HF-G20/Olympus E-PL5.
Tape capture using 6 VCR, TBC-1000, Elite BVP4+, Sony D8 camcorder with TBC.
https://www.facebook.com/BarryAFTT

Hi jerrys,

One can never be sure with Barry, but I suspect that he is saying that you must screw your head on a little differently when you want to unleash the power of PD9. That is, you must abandon the master track concept and revert to a multiple track approach. The concept is that PD9 has no primary track, as did earlier versions.

For instance, you should not move anything from track 1.
If you wish to overlay new audio, which plays contemporaneously with track 1 audio, simply place the new audio in a lower track (2,3,4, etc.). If you do not want the audio in track 1 to be heard, simply mute it with a right click and choose "mute". If the muted portion is to be within a longer segment, make a clip in the segment by the "split" command.

If you want to insert a "freeze frame" image, do so in a lower track, leaving track 1 alone. The freeze frame can over lay or exclude the image in track 1; etc. No need to move or delete anything in track 1. Nothing gets out of sync.

If you experiment by editing exclusively in multiple tracks, leaving track 1 alone, I think you will come to agree with me that PD9 is an awesome program.

I hope you will recognize that I am just trying to constructively reinforce what you have seen as a different way of thinking about the issue which you were dealing with, nothing more. I do not purport to be an accomplished editor, like many contributors to this forum are.

Regards,

Pax Laptop PC, ASUS
Core i7 Q 720
Win 7, 64-bit
RAM 8GB DDR2
Graphics, NVIDIA GeForce GTS 360M 1GB DDR5

Quote: Hi jerrys,

One can never be sure with Barry, but I suspect that he is saying that you must screw your head on a little differently when you want to unleash the power of PD9. That is, you must abandon the master track concept and revert to a multiple track approach. The concept is that PD9 has no primary track, as did earlier versions.

My head is sufficiently screwed, thank you very much.

Quote:
If you want to insert a "freeze frame" image, do so in a lower track, leaving track 1 alone. The freeze frame can over lay or exclude the image in track 1; etc. No need to move or delete anything in track 1. Nothing gets out of sync.

This is where you lose me. I only know one way to create a freeze frame, and that's by right-clicking on a clip and choosing "Freeze Frame". That has the immediate effect of splitting the clip and inserting the freeze frame at the split. So I have changed something in track 1.

Quote: If you experiment by editing exclusively in multiple tracks, leaving track 1 alone, I think you will come to agree with me that PD9 is an awesome program.

I've been using the multiple track stuff quite a bit. I just don't understand how I can do what I was trying to do without touching track 1. These are the steps that I would take:

Plop my clip onto track 1 of the timeline.

Position the scrubber at the frame I want to freeze.

Create the freeze frame.

At this point, I have a frozen frame that is five seconds long, in the middle of my clip. Both the video and the audio have been split.

Pull the frozen frame off track 1 and onto some other suitable track.

Use the "Remove and Close Gap" command to pull the two portions of the clip back together (so that there won't be any break in the audio).

For neatness, combine the two chunks of the clip.

Remove the sepia effect and the title (unless I want them, of course).

Position and set the duration of the freeze frame.

Am I missing something more elegant? Jerry Schwartz

Hi Jerry,

Thank you for keeping your temper in dealing with my earlier posts. I was very hesitant to make the second one because I knew it would look like I was trying to instruct you, which I am not qualified to do. I went ahead because I sincerely wanted to assist you with what I hoped would contribute to your editing prowess. My entire professional career has been built on "bearding the lion", trying to make sure I was right, then going ahead. That is what I did. You have handled yourself admirably.

In response to your latest reply, my emphasis on leaving track 1 alone was prompted by your response to my first reply: "If the "right" way to do this is to unlink the audio and move it down to another track, why isn't there an easy way to do this with multiple clips?"

I was trying to illustrate that there is an easier way and that is to simply leave the audio alone, mute it in track 1, copy what you want to use and place what audio you want in a lower track. This keeps sync.

My comment about the freeze frame was addressing your response to Carl on page 1 of this thread. I interpreted what you said as meaning that you had placed new matter in track 1 as a freeze frame. You can easily do this by placing any new matter of your choice in an unused part of the workspace and editing it to your liking. You can then move the new freeze frame where you want it to appear in your video, but in a lower track. I do not know if that is more elegant than what you did, but I do know it won't generate any gaps in track 1. I tried it, with and without transitions, and it worked just fine.

I hope this assists you in some small way.

Bohn Phillips Laptop PC, ASUS
Core i7 Q 720
Win 7, 64-bit
RAM 8GB DDR2
Graphics, NVIDIA GeForce GTS 360M 1GB DDR5

Quote: I only know one way to create a freeze frame, and that's by right-clicking on a clip and choosing "Freeze Frame".

Jerrys,

Just in case you’re unaware...
The Snapshot tool is the same thing as the right click Freeze Frame. The only difference, is that with the Snapshot tool, your chosen frame is placed directly in your library. As opposed to Freeze Frame, which goes one step further and also auto-inserts the frozen frame into the timeline.


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Hi all,

Very nice discussion here.. :
As newbie PD-er , me too I was surprised by the behavior of PD while inserting stuff.

I had a title object in the middle of my project which I liked to copy to the front of my project.
Right clicked the title, then 'Copy'.
Moved the timeline pointer to the beginning of the project and did a paste...
I inserted the title on the video track1.. move all the rest of the track to the right... but it left the audio track 1 unchanged... so de-synching the entire project...

I support Jerry's opinion : VERY strange behavior.. :
I would have expected that my entire project would have been moved to the right...

Happily , I'm a well trained "un-doer" :
Eventualley I worked around this mmm.. 'feature' ? via track 02....

By the way, does PD knows (like a fellow editor I used till recenlty) a way to grab and drag all the content to the right of my 'grabbing point' ?

Bye now
Hugo

Quote: Hi Jerry,

Thank you for keeping your temper in dealing with my earlier posts.

Not a problem at all. I took your posts in the spirit in which they were intended. I've been doing this forum stuff for well over 20 years, and I know a flame when I see one. A good flame-fest makes a knife fight look like a cotillion.

Quote: I was very hesitant to make the second one because I knew it would look like I was trying to instruct you, which I am not qualified to do.

You are selling yourself short. I appreciate your help. Jerry Schwartz

Quote:

Quote: I only know one way to create a freeze frame, and that's by right-clicking on a clip and choosing "Freeze Frame".

Jerrys,

Just in case you’re unaware...
The Snapshot tool is the same thing as the right click Freeze Frame. The only difference, is that with the Snapshot tool, your chosen frame is placed directly in your library. As opposed to Freeze Frame, which goes one step further and also auto-inserts the frozen frame into the timeline.

Doh! I knew that - once upon a time. Jerry Schwartz

Quote: Hi all,
By the way, does PD knows (like a fellow editor I used till recenlty) a way to grab and drag all the content to the right of my 'grabbing point' ?

Not that I've ever discovered.

More precisely, there isn't any way to select everything from the current clip to either end. Jerry Schwartz

Quote: Hi all,

Very nice discussion here.. :
As newbie PD-er , me too I was surprised by the behavior of PD while inserting stuff.

I had a title object in the middle of my project which I liked to copy to the front of my project.
Right clicked the title, then 'Copy'.
Moved the timeline pointer to the beginning of the project and did a paste...
I inserted the title on the video track1.. move all the rest of the track to the right... but it left the audio track 1 unchanged... so de-synching the entire project...

I support Jerry's opinion : VERY strange behavior.. :
I would have expected that my entire project would have been moved to the right...

Ah! That's something I mentioned somewhere in this thread, but it never became the focus. I think it deserves its own thread, so I'm going to start one: "Insert" behavior inconsistent.

Thanks for bringing it up. Jerry Schwartz

Hi Jerry,
I knew that what Cranston said,

Quote: Just in case you’re unaware...
The Snapshot tool is the same thing as the right click Freeze Frame. The only difference, is that with the Snapshot tool, your chosen frame is placed directly in your library. As opposed to Freeze Frame, which goes one step further and also auto-inserts the frozen frame into the timeline.

was inaccurate, so far as my set up was concerned. So, I did some investigating.

I found that in preferences, edit, I had checked "Add an effect and a title when using freeze frame". That checked box changes everything. With it unchecked, I find that I can change, or close, the audio gap generated when I use freeze frame. You might check to see if preference settings was the source of your original problem.

Pax Laptop PC, ASUS
Core i7 Q 720
Win 7, 64-bit
RAM 8GB DDR2
Graphics, NVIDIA GeForce GTS 360M 1GB DDR5

Quote:
I knew that what Cranston said, was inaccurate, so far as my set up was concerned. Pax

Pax, your mixing apples and oranges.

Jerry wrote:

“I only know one way to create a freeze frame, and that's by right-clicking on a clip and choosing "Freeze Frame”.

That was the statement that I was addressing in my reply, as I pointed out that one could use the Snapshot tool to get a single (frozen) frame. I was not addressing the Gap issue at all.

But please tell us what a Snapshot is, if it isn’t a snapshot of a single (frozen) frame, just like how using the Freeze Frame tool, yields a single (frozen) frame.

And sure, there is the option box in Preferences (that defaults to ON), that adds an Effect and a Title to the frozen frame, if you want PD to add them when one uses the Freeze Frame tool. It’s always been there over many of versions of PD. I’m glad you’ve discovered it. I’ve always had mine un-checked, as I prefer to add things like Titles and Effects by myself.

Click here PDtoots for a collection of PowerDirector Tutorials and Tips

Quote: Hi Jerry,
I found that in preferences, edit, I had checked "Add an effect and a title when using freeze frame". That checked box changes everything. With it unchecked, I find that I can change, or close, the audio gap generated when I use freeze frame. You might check to see if preference settings was the source of your original problem.
Pax

I did have that (automatic creation of an effect and a title) turned on. After reading your post, I turned it off and went through the drill again. This time, everything worked the way I wanted it to.

I decided to make a "before and after" demo, so I turned automatic creation of an effect and a title back on. I fully expected to have the same problems as before. Much to my chagrin it made no difference. Whether or not I had that option checked, everything seemed to go the way I wanted it to.

I must be doing something different this time, but I can't see what.

See attached. Jerry Schwartz

Hi jerrys,

For what it’s worth, I made a little quickie response video to your video above, showing another way of tackling the scenario you demonstrated and described.
Not saying it’s better, just throwing another option out there.

You can see here if you want to have a look.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9x2a16-MNE


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Tut, tut, Cranston.

If I mixed apples with oranges, it was only because I trusted that you were addressing the subject of the thread, "Closing a gap in a track", which you now state you were not doing.

Besides, anyone can see by going back to my actual post that your purported quote of my post deletes important matter which changes its meaning into something you can argue with. Tut. Tut.

If you honestly misinterpreted what I said, please read my post again. In no way did I say that what you said was inaccurate, only that my computer didn't act the way yours did.

Nevertheless, it appears that Jerry and I and 565 readers of this thread have learned that if an unwonted gap appears, which we cannot close and it is too late to use the undo option, we should check preferences to see if the "Add an effect and a title when using freeze frame" box is checked, unchecking that box may resolve the issue.

Pax Laptop PC, ASUS
Core i7 Q 720
Win 7, 64-bit
RAM 8GB DDR2
Graphics, NVIDIA GeForce GTS 360M 1GB DDR5

Bohn -

I'm not sure that "Tut tut" is a method of address conducive to problem solving. In fact, it's likely to lead to something tangential!

Quite clearly, the suggestion you've proposed (unchecking the effects/title option for Freeze Frame) & the method Cranston described in his linked video...

RESULT IN EXACTLY THE SAME THING Two (not dissimilar) ways of achieving the same thing.

Anyway - it's all been good healthy discussion & Jerry has been able to learn a more reliable approach.

Cheers - Tony
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Oh....I've had a good laugh this late evening....thanks, Bohn!

Now I can't get the old song "don't mess with my toot, toot" out of my head.
Some write it tu,tu/toot,toot or tut,tut.

Have fun!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9nmfcRp6ZY&feature=related

Just something.
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