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PD 11 Burned DVD will not play at TV station
BroDon316
Member Location: Landenberg, PA Joined: Jun 23, 2013 09:55 Messages: 51 Offline
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I recently made 3 DVDs to send to a TV station in Philadelphia PA, near where I live.

They said they could not open any of them.

They were made as described in this recent post: http://forum.cyberlink.com/forum/posts/list/29336.page#160670 which also has all the technical detail.

I made them with no menu so the DVD is supposed to start when loaded. They worked fine in my brand new DVD player and my 10 year old DVD player, as well as in 2 different computers, one 8 years old. Yet, the TV station said they would not open.

A few months ago I sent them 2 different DVDs burned in Pinnacle Ultimate Studio12, which does not have nearly the options that PD11 has. They were able to open these DVDs just fine. The Pin12 also have no menu. When inserted in my 10 year old DVD player, they play right away on any of may equipment, just like the non-menu PD11 DVDs do.

I am dealing with the Producer at the station but they are not very helpful, it is either works/does not work, no further info provided. So I have fix this without their help. I get one more chance to send them DVDs, kind of like throw them over the wall and see what sticks.

I assume their equipment is old as they only use DVDs for input, not video files. If it was brand new I would assume the PD11 DVDs would work fine. Also my Pin 12 software is about 10 years old and does not have any new bells and whistles.

Any ideas on how to make a PD11 DVD that will work for them?

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at Aug 03. 2013 21:03

PD 11 Ult Suite PD11.2812,
ASUS G750JW: Win 8 64-bit OS; Intel® Core™ i7-4700HQ processor, 2.4GHz (with Turbo Boost up to 3.4GHz); 8GB DDR3; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 765M 2GB graphic; HD 5400 rpm 1TB. USB 3.0 1-4TB.
Carl312
Senior Contributor Location: Texas, USA Joined: Mar 16, 2010 20:11 Messages: 9090 Offline
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I would burn a Folder only in PD 11.

You need the video on the timeline to be a MPEG2 HQ 30 fps video to burn the DVD from.

MPEG2 HQ is MPEG2 720x480 at 8 Mpbs. In the USA the Format is NTSC (30 fps). Be sure you have NTSC (30 FPS) Drop frame= Yes in Preferences > General

Then use ImgBurn or CdBurner XP (both free software) to burn the actual disk.

You want the lowest common denominator of DVD structure to play in older DVD players.
Carl312: Windows 10 64-bit 8 GB RAM,AMD Phenom II X4 965 3.4 GHz,ATI Radeon HD 5770 1GB,240GB SSD,two 1TB HDs.

BroDon316
Member Location: Landenberg, PA Joined: Jun 23, 2013 09:55 Messages: 51 Offline
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Hi Carl,

Thank you for the reply.

Please confirm the work flow.

My clips are already in NTSC 30fps, and that is set in the PD11 preferences also.

Right now the clips are HD, so do I convert to 4:3 for the burn to folder?

Then burn DVD only to a folder in PD11.

Then take the TS file and burn that to a DVD using one of the software you suggest.

Did I get that right? PD 11 Ult Suite PD11.2812,
ASUS G750JW: Win 8 64-bit OS; Intel® Core™ i7-4700HQ processor, 2.4GHz (with Turbo Boost up to 3.4GHz); 8GB DDR3; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 765M 2GB graphic; HD 5400 rpm 1TB. USB 3.0 1-4TB.
James Dotson
Senior Contributor Location: Tennessee Joined: Aug 24, 2009 20:40 Messages: 3066 Offline
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DVD does not have to be 4:3. __________________________________
CORNBLOSSOM
Carl312
Senior Contributor Location: Texas, USA Joined: Mar 16, 2010 20:11 Messages: 9090 Offline
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Quote: Hi Carl,

Thank you for the reply.

Please confirm the work flow.

My clips are already in NTSC 30fps, and that is set in the PD11 preferences also.

Right now the clips are HD, so do I convert to 4:3 for the burn to folder?

Then burn DVD only to a folder in PD11.

Then take the TS file and burn that to a DVD using one of the software you suggest.

Did I get that right?

I would produce a MPEG2 HQ video from the Edited HD video. The produced video file is .MPG.

Then put that produced MPEG2 video on the timeline, goto Create Disk (No Menu) and burn a Folder, depending on the length of the video you can use 2D DVD 4.7 GB or 8.5 GB as your Disk profile.

From the Disk Folder, use ImgBurn or CD Burner XP to burn the actual DVD Video disk.

Create Disk's Burn Folder makes a "My Video" folder that contains the structure of a DVD Video disk.
You can choose the location to create that "My Video" folder.

You can then test the disk by playing in a older (Cheap) DVD player.
Walmart sells a $30 DVD player that only plays NTSC DVDs. It will only play disks that have the correct NTSC structure.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Aug 04. 2013 08:42

Carl312: Windows 10 64-bit 8 GB RAM,AMD Phenom II X4 965 3.4 GHz,ATI Radeon HD 5770 1GB,240GB SSD,two 1TB HDs.

BroDon316
Member Location: Landenberg, PA Joined: Jun 23, 2013 09:55 Messages: 51 Offline
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Thanks Carl, I will work on it. - off to Walmart PD 11 Ult Suite PD11.2812,
ASUS G750JW: Win 8 64-bit OS; Intel® Core™ i7-4700HQ processor, 2.4GHz (with Turbo Boost up to 3.4GHz); 8GB DDR3; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 765M 2GB graphic; HD 5400 rpm 1TB. USB 3.0 1-4TB.
BroDon316
Member Location: Landenberg, PA Joined: Jun 23, 2013 09:55 Messages: 51 Offline
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Hi Carl,

I got a $24.85 DVD player, Funai brand, from Walmart.

All my DVDs work in it, no matter how I made them. Even the ones that the TV station said they could not open.

Originally I had made dups of the ones I sent the station, so the station got dups not origionals. But the masters and the dups work fine in the little cheapo player. My dup machine does 11 at once so I ran 4 dups off the master so I would have some to test for any problems. I checked them all in my old DVD player before senting them in, and they worked fine, as did all the sibling dups.

I even went back and played them all again in my 10 year old DVD player that is more finicky than any others in my house. Again, they all worked fine.

There is not the option that somehow I sent the station a PAL format.

So I am back to shooting in the blind as I cannot replicate, with any DVD player I have, the TV station experience.

What I will do is follow your flow path and burn the DVDs from the freeware.

While I did make the TS files with the folder burn, I did not get a chance to burn any with your recommended freeware (I hope they work with Windows . Will tackle that tomorrow AM.

Any other ideas? PD 11 Ult Suite PD11.2812,
ASUS G750JW: Win 8 64-bit OS; Intel® Core™ i7-4700HQ processor, 2.4GHz (with Turbo Boost up to 3.4GHz); 8GB DDR3; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 765M 2GB graphic; HD 5400 rpm 1TB. USB 3.0 1-4TB.
Carl312
Senior Contributor Location: Texas, USA Joined: Mar 16, 2010 20:11 Messages: 9090 Offline
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Quote: All my DVDs work in it, no matter how I made them. Even the ones that the TV station said they could not open.

While I did make the TS files with the folder burn, I did not get a chance to burn any with your recommended freeware (I hope they work with Windows . Will tackle that tomorrow AM.

Any other ideas?

Ask the station engineer what format video the station needs.

You need the answer to the file type, the TV Mode (NTSC or PAL) and whether they want a standard DVD Video Disk.
Standard Definition or High Definition video.

One assumes that they wanted a standard DVD Disk. They may want a MPG file.

The freeware works in Windows XP, Windows 7 and I think Windows 8.
Carl312: Windows 10 64-bit 8 GB RAM,AMD Phenom II X4 965 3.4 GHz,ATI Radeon HD 5770 1GB,240GB SSD,two 1TB HDs.

ynotfish
Senior Contributor Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9977 Offline
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BroDon -

I'll be of no help here. I can't even work out why a TV station would want DVD quality videos!!! That's aside from not understanding why the same TV station doesn't have a device capable of playing them!

I'm sure you've called them and explained that the discs are in standard DVD format and run fine on your players.

Cheers - Tony
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BroDon316
Member Location: Landenberg, PA Joined: Jun 23, 2013 09:55 Messages: 51 Offline
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I would produce a MPEG2 HQ video from the Edited HD video. The produced video file is .MPG.

Then put that produced MPEG2 video on the timeline, goto Create Disk (No Menu) and burn a Folder, depending on the length of the video you can use 2D DVD 4.7 GB or 8.5 GB as your Disk profile.

From the Disk Folder, use ImgBurn or CD Burner XP to burn the actual DVD Video disk.


I guess I missed that "make a MPEG2" part. What format would you use to make the file to brun the final from?
HQ 720-480/60i (8Mbps) or 1280x720/30p (20Mbps)?

Now I see. On the PD11 Edit page I have it set as 4:3, and this gives me certain options in the Produce section, and the two options I mention above.. If I have it set on 16:9, I get different options on what file types I can produce to.

So I am now confused. My clips are shot in HD, 16:9, does it make a difference for an old DVD player if it is not 4:3? I seem to remember all the debates years ago on DVDs playing on TVs. Back then, normal and wide screen all played anyway, it just mattered if the screen had black bands on the top and bottom or not.

I guess I could send in 4:3 and tell them widescreen is available, if they want it. Does this sound reasonable?

So I guess question is: for 4:3 and for 16:9 what formats do I produce to?

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Aug 04. 2013 23:34

PD 11 Ult Suite PD11.2812,
ASUS G750JW: Win 8 64-bit OS; Intel® Core™ i7-4700HQ processor, 2.4GHz (with Turbo Boost up to 3.4GHz); 8GB DDR3; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 765M 2GB graphic; HD 5400 rpm 1TB. USB 3.0 1-4TB.
Carl312
Senior Contributor Location: Texas, USA Joined: Mar 16, 2010 20:11 Messages: 9090 Offline
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The best thing to do is ask the Station engineer what they need.

Tony, a DVD can be a medium for transporting a Video File, If the station is looking for standard Definition video, then A DVD video disk would work.

Truth, we do not know what format the station wants or needs.
Carl312: Windows 10 64-bit 8 GB RAM,AMD Phenom II X4 965 3.4 GHz,ATI Radeon HD 5770 1GB,240GB SSD,two 1TB HDs.

BroDon316
Member Location: Landenberg, PA Joined: Jun 23, 2013 09:55 Messages: 51 Offline
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Do you know any way I can look at a burned DVD and find out all the details of the contents?

PD 11 Ult Suite PD11.2812,
ASUS G750JW: Win 8 64-bit OS; Intel® Core™ i7-4700HQ processor, 2.4GHz (with Turbo Boost up to 3.4GHz); 8GB DDR3; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 765M 2GB graphic; HD 5400 rpm 1TB. USB 3.0 1-4TB.
James Dotson
Senior Contributor Location: Tennessee Joined: Aug 24, 2009 20:40 Messages: 3066 Offline
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Do you mean something like Media Info or GSpot? __________________________________
CORNBLOSSOM
BroDon316
Member Location: Landenberg, PA Joined: Jun 23, 2013 09:55 Messages: 51 Offline
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I guess so, if they can take an existing DVD and tell you what format, 60i or 60p, etc is on the disk.

I will check them out. PD 11 Ult Suite PD11.2812,
ASUS G750JW: Win 8 64-bit OS; Intel® Core™ i7-4700HQ processor, 2.4GHz (with Turbo Boost up to 3.4GHz); 8GB DDR3; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 765M 2GB graphic; HD 5400 rpm 1TB. USB 3.0 1-4TB.
BroDon316
Member Location: Landenberg, PA Joined: Jun 23, 2013 09:55 Messages: 51 Offline
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Here is the Media Info sheet on a video file for D-1, where it was produced in AVC 1920x1080/60i (24Mbps), taken to Pinacle 12 and produced as a DVD.

I used Pinacle 12 as it made the previous DVDs that the station could read.

Does anyone see any issues on this sheet?
 Filename
Pin12 file S1 D1 HD 60i 24Mbps PD11.txt
[Disk]
 Description
 Filesize
18 Kbytes
 Downloaded:
513 time(s)
PD 11 Ult Suite PD11.2812,
ASUS G750JW: Win 8 64-bit OS; Intel® Core™ i7-4700HQ processor, 2.4GHz (with Turbo Boost up to 3.4GHz); 8GB DDR3; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 765M 2GB graphic; HD 5400 rpm 1TB. USB 3.0 1-4TB.
BroDon316
Member Location: Landenberg, PA Joined: Jun 23, 2013 09:55 Messages: 51 Offline
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I find this most amazing. Using Media Info I compared D-1 burned with Pinnacle 12, PD11, ImgBurn and CDBurnerXP.

What I found was that the data in each BUP, IFO and VOB was the same. The only difference is the order of the files.

CDBurnerXP and PD11
TS.IFO
TS.VOB
TS.BUP

-0.IFO
-1.VOB
-2.VOB
-3.VOB
-4.VOB

-0.BPU

Pin12 and ImgBurn
TS.BUP
TS.IFO
TS.VOB

-0.BUP
-0.IFO
-1.VOB
-2.VOB
-3.VOB



So the sequence of files in Pin12 and ImgBurn are exactly the same, while they are diffirent in CDBurnerXP.

Again all the data in each file, such as -0.BUP, was the same in all three burned DVDs, but the location of that -0.BUP was different on the DVD disc as reported by Media Info.

So my solution, since I have D-1, D-2 and D-3 to send to the station is to label them differently and send one of each. D-1 is the CDBurnerXP and D-2 is the ImgBurn, and both were made from the Pin12 file burn made from the PD11 60i 24Mbps prodiced file, and D-3 is the Pin12 burned DVD made directly from the 60i 24Mbps PD11 produced file.

While I did not go back and make a PD11 without intro menu, the sequence of files in the burned D-1 DVD is the same as in the CDBurnerXP. and not the ImgBurn or Pinnacle 12. Based on the fact that the Pin12 did work at the station several months ago, if sequence drives the issue, then the ImgBurn and Pin12 DVDs should load OK for them.

The best I can figure, and I did not keep good notes, is that in the last submission, due to the pixilation issue on D-2 and D-3, I made them all from PD11 produced files and probably used 60p 28Mbps as the PD11 produced files, thinking more data was better for a later use video file. Yes, I did not pay a lot of attention to i and p, like I do now.

Is it possible for a 60p file to retain that format when made to a DVD? If so that explains the TV station issue as they run on 60i.

Is there a way to tell if the DVD is in i or p format after it is burned?

What is amazing is that in all my DVD players, including the cheap one from Walmart, play all these DVDs. Those made from 60i and 60p PD11 produced video files.

So even though my finiky Toshiba TV with the built in DVD player is 10 years old, they appaerently were accomodating any "p" in a DVD back then.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at Aug 07. 2013 23:45

PD 11 Ult Suite PD11.2812,
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BroDon316
Member Location: Landenberg, PA Joined: Jun 23, 2013 09:55 Messages: 51 Offline
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DUH… I finally used Media Info to go back and look at the TV Station failed DVDs. And there are lots of differences from those above. Using the D-1 file that was made from a produced PD11 file (probalby 60p) and burned with Nero 12.

First the file sequence is different:

TS.IFO
TS.BUP
-0.IFO
-1.VOB
-2.VOB
-3.VOB
-4.VOB
-0.BUP
So compared to above, TS.VOB is missing. The overall sequence is similar to CDBurnerXP. I did read that TS.VOB is optional in the DVD standard, but my concern is the TV Station, where at present I am not allowed to talk to the technical person/engineer, or if that person knows how to help anyway.

Other differences include a file size of 8.00 KiB versus 12.00 KiB
No audio data in the TS.IFO and TS.BUP file.

In the -0.IFO file:
-The file size is 48 KiB vs 42.KiB
-The duration is the same of 1 h 6min
-The overall bit rate is 98 bps vs 86 bps (could this be the difference between P and I?)

So maybe this is why they would not load at the TV Station.
And if all the above is relevant, I suspect that all these variants I am sending to the TV station will load just fine.

I do seem to remember that TV stations do not use retail DVD players but load them up into a player for TV broadcasting, and that requires interlaced encoding only.

DUH #2... I had time to make another DVD similar to the ones that worked at the TV Station several months ago, and the file structure is like ImgBurn and Pin12 above, as it was made with Pinnacle 12 straight from the VIXIA HF10 camcorder set at 60i frame rate mode.

I will update when I hear back from the TV Station.

This message was edited 10 times. Last update was at Aug 08. 2013 09:50

PD 11 Ult Suite PD11.2812,
ASUS G750JW: Win 8 64-bit OS; Intel® Core™ i7-4700HQ processor, 2.4GHz (with Turbo Boost up to 3.4GHz); 8GB DDR3; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 765M 2GB graphic; HD 5400 rpm 1TB. USB 3.0 1-4TB.
Carl312
Senior Contributor Location: Texas, USA Joined: Mar 16, 2010 20:11 Messages: 9090 Offline
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Perhaps information about the correct structure of a DVD Video will help solve the dilemma.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD-Video#Filesystem

Carl312: Windows 10 64-bit 8 GB RAM,AMD Phenom II X4 965 3.4 GHz,ATI Radeon HD 5770 1GB,240GB SSD,two 1TB HDs.

Rob1492 [Avatar]
Newbie Joined: Jan 20, 2012 00:52 Messages: 47 Offline
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It is possible the problem may be related to your choice of DVD-R vs DVD+R media, or the brand of DVD recordable media, and so no matter what you do, the station's DVD player/system will reject it.
BroDon316
Member Location: Landenberg, PA Joined: Jun 23, 2013 09:55 Messages: 51 Offline
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Hi Rob,

That is true. So with the 3 DVDs I just sent in, they are on two different disc types. DVD-R, Taiyo Yuden Premium and Memorex. The Memorex were the same ones that the TV station loaded fine a few months ago.

I expect to hear something Monday or Tuesday next week. PD 11 Ult Suite PD11.2812,
ASUS G750JW: Win 8 64-bit OS; Intel® Core™ i7-4700HQ processor, 2.4GHz (with Turbo Boost up to 3.4GHz); 8GB DDR3; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 765M 2GB graphic; HD 5400 rpm 1TB. USB 3.0 1-4TB.
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