Quote I've been converting a client's PAL 4:3 Mini DV tapes to MP4. I started by copying them to DVD, then I imported the .vob into PD17 and export using a custom profile set to 1280x720.

The first video I exported using this profile, I set the bitrate to 40,000 kps. The 10 minute test clocked in at 1.69 GB (1,821,850,243 bytes) which was a little too big.

So the second test I did, I lowered the bitrate to 30,000 kps. The same 10 minute test footage ended up clocking in at 1.70 GB (1,836,023,362 bytes)!!

1. Can anyone please explain how it's possible for this to happen?!


2. The project is set to 4:3 PAL and PD17 suggests the following resolutions - 720x576 (PAL DVD) which is the correct ratio for 4:3 but it also suggests 1280x720, 1920x1080 etc which I am led to believe are 16:9 resolutions. Yet, when I view the 1280x720 encoded footage it indeed appears to be 4:3. Can anyone please explain why a 16:9 resolution is able to display perfect 4:3?

Many thanks as always!

1. Your bitrate is set too high. The correct default sd 640 x 480 (4:3 AR) pal mp4 bitrate is 6000 kb/s. 10 sec. of the original PAL DV produced to a 1920 x 1080/50i custom created profile = 1828/6000 = .30 of setting. 2.17MB. 6x10x2.17MB=130.2MB for 10 minute video.

2. PD17 did not suggest it. It is from the dropdown arrow selection. Nonsquare pixels were then used to create it so it displays as 4:3 AR in all the video players I used.

You do realize that the vob file you created may be 720 x 576 resolution. 720/576 = 1.25 and not the 4:3 AR =1.33 so nonsquare pixels were again used earlier when you converted PAL DV to A DVD .vob file.

Quote

1. Your bitrate is set too high. The correct default sd 640 x 480 (4:3 AR) pal mp4 bitrate is 6000 kb/s. 10 sec. of the original PAL DV produced to a 1920 x 1080/50i custom created profile = 1828/6000 = .30 of setting. 2.17MB. 6x10x2.17MB=130.2MB for 10 minute video.

2. PD17 did not suggest it. It is from the dropdown arrow selection. Nonsquare pixels were then used to create it so it displays as 4:3 AR in all the video players I used.

You do realize that the vob file you created may be 720 x 576 resolution. 720/576 = 1.25 and not the 4:3 AR =1.33 so nonsquare pixels were again used earlier when you converted PAL DV to A DVD .vob file.

Hi, thanks for your reply.

The intention of this project is to convert the DVDs to MP4 without losing any quality whatsoever. I figured if I chose 1280x720 it would "upscale" the footage and since the max bitrate is higher for 1280x720 that would help (please see point 3!)

1. Sorry you've totally lost me here! Can you please help me understand how the bitrate can be too high in layman's terms? PD gives you the option of setting it up to 40,000 for 1280x720 which is what I chose. If it's not advisable to go above 6,000 then why does PD give you the option?
   
   When the bitrate is at the 6,000 default there's some quailtiy loss. Do you mean that even when set to 40,000 PD defaults to 6,000 which is why there was little difference between the file size when I set it to 14,000 vs 13,000? I realise I probably sound like an idiot but I want to learn more about this!

"10 sec. of the original PAL DV produced to a 1920 x 1080/50i custom created profile = 1828/6000 = .30 of setting. 2.17MB. 6x10x2.17MB=130.2MB for 10 minute video"

I didn't produce a 1920x1080 video, though. It was set to 1280x720.

2. Ok, sorry, it didn't suggest it but it's one of the possible options. I assumed that PD would know the original video is 720x576 and therefor it limited the options in the drop down box to ones that would maintain the AR and "upscale" the video. Actually, when I imported the PD produced 1280x720 video into Avidemux, it displayed at 16:9...does that mean PD is exporting at 1920x1080 with a flag to tell the player to display at 4:3? Can you please help me to understand this?

3. Yes I am aware the DVD .vob is 720x576 resolution, I didn't export at 720x576 because when I have done in the past, the quality has been lower than the original vob. I figured if I upscaled the video to 1280x720 there would be less loss of quality because 1280x720 allows for a higher bitrate (40,000 vs 14,000 for 720x576) - am I wrong in thinking that?

What steps would you recommend to continue? I'm coming into this from music preservation experience - even if the original source is low quality (tape etc) you encode it at the highest possible quality (wav, flac or losst mp3 320kbs) to try to maintain the original as best as possible

Anyone else able to help?

if you want 4:3 aspect ratio videos to look 16:9 then you must use Set Clip Attributes- Set Aspect Ratio... you have to stretch the original videos.

and you're upscaling 720x576 resolution to 1280x720 with too high video bitrate like Tomasc have said.

example. just draw a black thick line on the balloon and start to blow air into it. correct air pressure(video bitrate) for the balloon is 6-8Mb/sec. to maintain the thick black line look...
first you had a small balloon(SD) then you've blew it up to bigger balloon(HD) without noticing the that black line has become a dark grey in color??? 30-40Mb/sec...

create a custom profile at 1280x720 8-10Mb/sec and see if it's acceptable quality.
if you don't want to create a custom profile then just use the PD recommended video bitrate at 1280x720 16Mb/sec.
it is far more than the captured video bitrates.

happy happy joy joy

PepsiMan
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