Looking to film a SBS 3D clip. If I have separate video files, can I merge them in PD13?

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dgrams

Newbie Joined: Mar 24, 2015 12:09 Messages: 2 Offline

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Mar 24, 2015 12:35

I know all (or many) of the basics about filming and making 3D... time to take it to video. (But without buying expensive video equipment - because that just is not in the cards. Good thing I have lots of time on my hands!)

I am already taking pairs (Left and Right views) of photos off my galaxy S5 phone, editing them into SBS photos in Photoshop and getting SBS 3D to work in my Google Cardboard device...

That is easy-peasy.

So now... Video.

I have two galaxy S4 cameras mounted on a stablizer bar... Recording video at the same time on each camera.

What I want to know is... #1) am I going to be able to manually able to get the two videos to play starting at the same point in time, considering the files are not automagically going to be in sync from when I start recording on each device?

AND... #2) will PD13 have any type of features that will allow me to take the two clips, once I have them 'in sync' and put them side by side in equal amounts within the active frame to play together? (Thus resulting in what I need for SBS playback?)

example: SBS Example (youtube)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Mar 24. 2015 12:41

SoNic67

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 27, 2014 14:14 Messages: 1308 Offline

Mar 24, 2015 17:04

MultiCam plug-in can synchronize them.
However, you might want to look into other 3D option, not just SBS. Like HOU (top-and-bottom) - best format for passive 3D TV's.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Mar 24. 2015 17:05

GGRussell

Senior Contributor Joined: Jan 08, 2012 11:38 Messages: 709 Offline

Mar 24, 2015 17:41

PD13 can convert 2D to 3D, but can not take two separate tracks and create 3D output. Intel i7 4770k, 16GB, GTX1060 3GB, Two 240GB SSD, 4TB HD, Sony HDR-TD20V 3D camcorder, Sony SLT-A65VK for still images, Windows 10 Pro, 64bit
Gary Russell -- TN USA

SoNic67

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 27, 2014 14:14 Messages: 1308 Offline

Mar 24, 2015 19:40

Sure you can. You just need to be imaginative, see attached an ideea of 3D HOU (top-bottom).

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Filename	3d_HOU.jpg	Download
Description
Filesize	418 Kbytes
Downloaded:	206 time(s)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Mar 24. 2015 19:40

GGRussell

Senior Contributor Joined: Jan 08, 2012 11:38 Messages: 709 Offline

Mar 24, 2015 23:35

Personally I wouldn't want to edit multiple clips that way. Tedious at best. I know of only one consumer app that can create full HD using footage from two cameras and I'm not even sure if the latest version still does. Intel i7 4770k, 16GB, GTX1060 3GB, Two 240GB SSD, 4TB HD, Sony HDR-TD20V 3D camcorder, Sony SLT-A65VK for still images, Windows 10 Pro, 64bit
Gary Russell -- TN USA

SoNic67

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 27, 2014 14:14 Messages: 1308 Offline

Mar 25, 2015 06:26

For full HD 3D, a custom frame size for the project needs to be created - of double height.

dgrams

Newbie Joined: Mar 24, 2015 12:09 Messages: 2 Offline

Mar 25, 2015 07:57

Cool. Thanks for the tips. MultiCam plugin... looking for info on where to get this?

I just found that you can sync videos by audio. I wonder how well this works.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YazEBOU5oW0

It also looks like there is a multi-cam designer in PD13?
http://www.cyberlink.com/products/powerdirector-ultimate/features_en_US.html?&r=1

GGRussell

Senior Contributor Joined: Jan 08, 2012 11:38 Messages: 709 Offline

Mar 25, 2015 09:43

Quote: For full HD 3D, a custom frame size for the project needs to be created - of double height.

Trying to add 3D text or effects would be very difficult if not impossible. If the poster just needs cuts, it would work, but personally I wouldn't go through all that trouble.

dgrams - the multicam editor is part of PD13. I've never used it.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Mar 25. 2015 09:45

Intel i7 4770k, 16GB, GTX1060 3GB, Two 240GB SSD, 4TB HD, Sony HDR-TD20V 3D camcorder, Sony SLT-A65VK for still images, Windows 10 Pro, 64bit
Gary Russell -- TN USA

SoNic67

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 27, 2014 14:14 Messages: 1308 Offline

Mar 25, 2015 18:59

Well, true, for effects or 3D text you need something else.

Fabbian

Newbie Joined: Mar 08, 2015 13:27 Messages: 29 Offline

Mar 26, 2015 08:14

Quote: Personally I wouldn't want to edit multiple clips that way. Tedious at best. I know of only one consumer app that can create full HD using footage from two cameras and I'm not even sure if the latest version still does.

What program is that? I know Magix Movie Edit Pro Plus will combine two video streams into a 3D video stream. Are there others?

Power Director will align multiple video streams by matching their audio tracks. What would it take to add the capability to tell the program "these streams are the left and right parts of a stereo pair?"

SoNic67

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 27, 2014 14:14 Messages: 1308 Offline

Mar 26, 2015 09:43

Fabian, did you look at my post with attachment above?

Fabbian

Newbie Joined: Mar 08, 2015 13:27 Messages: 29 Offline

Mar 27, 2015 08:42

Quote: Fabian, did you look at my post with attachment above?

I did, but it doesn't help me. You've uploaded a screenshot which shows one image over another on a 2D produce page. I can do that in Paint.

Can you describe the process, step-by-step, for taking two video streams, aligning them, and merging them into a single 3D video stream? Either side-by-side (SBS) or top-and-bottom (TAB) would be fine, but it would be better if you could combine the two video streams into a multi-view coding (MVC) stream.

In Magix, you place the two clips on the time line in adjacent tracks. You select the clip on the upper track, click the "Effects" tab, select "Stereo 3D/Properties" from the effects list and select "Stereo 3D pair (left image first)" from the drop-down menu. Now the two clips are linked together. Selecting either selects both. The next step is to align and trim them. Click "Stereo 3D/Aligning". Scroll down to "Shift frames" and click "Automatic". That aligns both clips using their audio track and trims them to the same length. Now you have a single 3D clip which you can edit as you wish. You can align the images horizontally, vertically, and rotationally. You can trim or split the clip as you would with any 2D clip.

My reason for describing the Magix process in such detail is to give you an example of the kind of description I need to accomplish the creation of a 3D video stream from a pair of 2D streams in Power Director. I need more than a picture to understand how to do it. Don't think I am in any way extolling the virtues of Magix over Power Director. Power Director is much faster and easier to work with than Magix.

SoNic67

Senior Contributor Joined: Sep 27, 2014 14:14 Messages: 1308 Offline

Mar 27, 2015 10:02

Well, I said you need to be imaginative and you are talking about paint. You want a step-by-step...
Let's assume you aligned them already. A clapper helps for that.

1. Place the files on two tracks.
2. Select first track (from left camera) and reduce only the height at 50% (you need to de-select the "maintain aspect ratio" tickmark for that).
3. Move the compressed image to top of frame.
4. Repeat for track #2 and move the compressed image on bottom.
5. Render. You have a file in 3D HOU format, that will play on a 3D TV (like my Visio).

Like this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PzI_EfbaYU

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at Mar 27. 2015 10:18

Fabbian

Newbie Joined: Mar 08, 2015 13:27 Messages: 29 Offline

Mar 27, 2015 23:40

Quote: Well, I said you need to be imaginative and you are talking about paint. You want a step-by-step...
Let's assume you aligned them already. A clapper helps for that.

1. Place the files on two tracks.
2. Select first track (from left camera) and reduce only the height at 50% (you need to de-select the "maintain aspect ratio" tickmark for that).
3. Move the compressed image to top of frame.
4. Repeat for track #2 and move the compressed image on bottom.
5. Render. You have a file in 3D HOU format, that will play on a 3D TV (like my Visio).

Like this one: [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PzI_EfbaYU

]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PzI_EfbaYU

[/url]

Thanks for the detailed explanation. Do I understand correctly that you will have two tracks, one with the upper image and one with the lower and when you render your movie those two tracks will be combined?

Fabbian

Newbie Joined: Mar 08, 2015 13:27 Messages: 29 Offline

Mar 31, 2015 08:39

Quote: They will be both on the final movie, each at 1/2 of screen height. The TV knows how to combine them for a 3D effect.
Well... of course you have to select that from remote - see below Vizio's Side-By-Side or Top-Bottom. I strongly recomend Top-Bottom, on some TV's it has more (double) quality than SBS.

That's a useful trick and you are correct that TAB preserves more resolution than SBS on TVs that use passive glasses. Those TVs use alternate scan lines to display the left and right images so each eye sees a 1920 x 540 pixel image. Each half of a TAB image is 1920 x 540 so there's no further loss of resolution when the TV spreads them over alternate scan lines. With SBS format you start with a pair of 960 x 1080 images. The TV stretches the 960 to 1920 but, of course, it can't supply the additional detail. Once the image is squashed down to 960 that detail is lost forever. Then the TV throws away half of the 1080 pixels on the vertical dimension so you wind up with each eye seeing an image whose true resolution is just 960 x 540.

Active shutter TVs lose quality by showing each frame for a shorter period. Instead of losing pixels along the vertical dimension they lose them over the temporal dimension. The user perceives it as reduced brightness.

Multi-View Coding (MVC) works best for 3D Blu-Ray disks (BD). 3D TVs will detect the 3D format and automatically switch to 3D mode. 2D TVs will play show just the left eye view. It allows you to produce a single BD for both 2D and 3D viewers. If you use either SBS or TAB format for 3D you'll need another version for 2D.

I would really like to find a way to combine video streams from a twin camera rig directly into a 3D MVC format. I know you can render a movie in TAB format using your method, then re-render it into MVC. That process loses half the resolution when you compress the images vertically. If anyone can figure out how to avoid that step I would sure like to hear about it.

I know the original topic was how to combine video streams from two cameras into a 3D SBS movie, but I hope this topic drift is acceptable.