Samsung NX1 H.265 HEVC 4k Clips to Test with PD13

Tasmanian

Newbie Joined: Nov 22, 2014 08:55 Messages: 14 Offline

Solved by

Nov 22, 2014 09:31

At the Imaging Resource site, William Brawley has posted links to several video clips shot with the new Samsung NX1. They are in their original h.265 codec and have not been tinkered.

http://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2014/11/19/samsung-nx1-4k-video-samples-and-new-full-res-frame-grabs-available-for-do

At this time, PowerDirector 13 is the only editing product that claims to support h.265. Other tools may transcode it to h.264 or maybe ProRes, but that seems like a slow workflow that adds to quality loss too. I can't help but think that CL cooperated with Samsung in conjunction with h.265, since the NX1 (and a budget NX model to appear in January) are the only enthusiast or semi-pro devices that use h.265 currently, although it has been used in some security cameras for a while.

But how stable or fluid is an h.265 editing process with PD13? Other threads mention encoding to h.265, which understandably might be slow. It might not achieve much, either, until h.265 streaming or playback becomes more widespread. However, h.265 will probably become mainstream by 2016, since it will be the only way to stream HQ HD, or any 4k at all, without monster amounts of bandwidth. It may also be at the heart of real 4k Blu-ray, if that ever comes to fruition. So it really is worth learning whether PD13 can handle h.265 and what sort of computer innards it takes.

I have used PD12, and might upgrade to PD13, once there is a patch that allows burning 50p / 60p Blu-ray at proper 28mbs and fixes other observed problems. The export to h.265 is one thing. Editing native h.265 is something else. Does PD13 use proxy files? How fast or slow can it handle edit effects like crop or pan? Must preview be limited to low resolution? Is there anyone out there with a PC rigged with a proper 4k graphics card and display too? I have a 2013 Toshiba gaming laptop that can play the 4k clips with Potplayer, but the display is only 1080p. How well does PDVD14 handle HEVC?

If conversion to h.264 is more or less mandatory, that is not good news.

Thanks for any comments, experiences, or guidance.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Nov 22. 2014 09:39

PowerDirector 12 (pondering 16)
Toshiba Qosmio X875, i7 3630QM 2.4 ghz, 16GB RAM, GeForce GTX 670M with 3GB video RAM.
HDC-SDT750, HX9V, GoPro Hero HD, LX7, LX100. Looking for, but cannot find, gear and software to author UHD 4k discs.

Tomas G77

Member Location: Ayrshire Joined: Jun 13, 2008 08:54 Messages: 100 Offline

Nov 22, 2014 10:37

See here Cinemartin

http://www.cinemartin.com/cinec/hevc-h265/

also see www.mainconcept.com they do a converter

I suppose its like everything else if you want the best encoder you have to pay

Cinemartin can be downloaded as a trial, if your interested it comes as a plugin for Prem Pro, don't no if there's a standalone version

I plan to purchase the Samsung NX1 but I'm waiting till after xmas as the price will come down and it will have a better firmware by then I hope ,
anyway no use buying till they do some serious testing and the h265 codec is supported in the meantime I use my Pentax K3

until it sells on ebay

Please keep us posted if you manage to get a converter for the H265 I do know the one that Samsung supplies with the camera is crap
and it also needs some work,

but Cyberlink are pretty good at sorting these bugs and I hope they will bring patch out soon.

Cheers Tom G Thomas G
I'm a 33yr old trapped in a 69yr old body

Tasmanian

Newbie Joined: Nov 22, 2014 08:55 Messages: 14 Offline

Nov 22, 2014 18:55

Thanks for the reply. However, I'm curious whether PD13 can be used to edit the NX1 HEVC h.265 without pre-conversion. According to the stated specifications, yes, but it would be real great to have a PD13 user's testimony. That's why I furnished the links to Brawley's sample files. They can be downloaded and presumably imported into a PD13 test project to see if the edit functions are stable or hang, and whether the edited files can be exported as h.265 or h264 and retain most of their image and motion quality.

Potplayer (http://potplayer.daum.net/#none) is free and plays the NX1 files without trouble on my Toshiba Qosmio X875 with a 2012 vintage i7 3630QM CPU and NVIDIA GTX670M. Of course, the display is only 1080p, but the video clips are much more detailed, downsampled, than I experience with run-of-the-mill 1080p clips. If PD13 employs proxy files for h.265 4k, perhaps editing is no trouble, except for slower export "production." But that is only a guess.

Cinemartin costs money and is probably relevant only for people who want ProRes as an intermediate codec for fancy grading. That is way outside my need, resources, or skill. If PD13 can work with h.265 natively, and convert it to mp4 for streaming or AVCHD for Blu-ray, it spares quality loss to avoid rendering or recoding any more than once. My current interest in 4k is to get better 1080p results and also be able to crop, pan, and stabilize without quality loss when downsized to 1080p. We are still a year or two away from widespread sharing of 4k as 4k, but that will surely involve h.265, since the older codecs require too much bandwidth or disc space. The 5mbps "HD" one currently streams on YouTube should look better when h.265 or Google's own version gets employed. 4k video streamed at only 15mbps might at least be passable as UHD if the h.265 codec is employed.

Meanwhile, I am also waiting to see if the 1080 50p/60p Blu-ray glitch (bitrate cut from 28mbps to 16mbps) gets patched before biting the PD13 hook myself. PD12 spooked me for months because 1080p clips' video and audio tracks became separated and out of sync when one re-opened projects with lots of edit effects. A patch eventually appeared. Since PD13 is new, I suspect the best time to upgrade will be after the second or third patch appears. Meanwhile, perhaps there are some intrepid early adopters who might be curious to test the NX1 HEVC h.265 4k clips provided at the Imaging Resource file to see what happens.

The NX1 body price may fall slightly in two months. From a bargain-hunter's standpoint, the real question is whether Samsung will roll out a lower cost junior version of the NX1 in January. The other speculation is whether Sony will introduce an alpha APS-c or FF camera that has 5-axis IBIS, captures 4k internally. Whether they offer h.265 too may depend on whether Samsung's copper-circuit back-lit sensor offers advantages the others can't yet match. The competing models will prompt Samsung to trim its body prices some. Lenses will remain pricey.

I encourage PD13 users with fast PCs and an interest in 4k to download the h.265 HEVC files at the aforementioned IR site and report what happens. Thanks.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Nov 29. 2014 09:49

PowerDirector 12 (pondering 16)
Toshiba Qosmio X875, i7 3630QM 2.4 ghz, 16GB RAM, GeForce GTX 670M with 3GB video RAM.
HDC-SDT750, HX9V, GoPro Hero HD, LX7, LX100. Looking for, but cannot find, gear and software to author UHD 4k discs.

PapidoFrance45

Member Location: France-St jean le blanc Joined: Jan 21, 2011 05:06 Messages: 83 Offline

Nov 23, 2014 03:13

Hi Tasmanian ,

Files indicated in your link cannot be opened (" corrupt file "). Hi All

Win10 64bits PRO OEM - i7 3820 3.6Ghz - 18Go de Ram-GTX960 (375.95)

ynotfish

Senior Contributor Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9977 Offline

Nov 23, 2014 04:57

PapidoFrance -

I got the same error using WaterFox. Using Chrome I just right clicked > Save link as. All good.

Tasmanian - I'm yet to put the downloaded clips through their paces with PDR13.

Cheers - Tony
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PapidoFrance45

Member Location: France-St jean le blanc Joined: Jan 21, 2011 05:06 Messages: 83 Offline

Nov 23, 2014 05:33

ynotfish ,

Thank you. Yes, it is quite good.
Hi All

Win10 64bits PRO OEM - i7 3820 3.6Ghz - 18Go de Ram-GTX960 (375.95)

PapidoFrance45

Member Location: France-St jean le blanc Joined: Jan 21, 2011 05:06 Messages: 83 Offline

Nov 23, 2014 09:17

Report tests:

5 files stemming from Samsung NX1 are accepted by PD13.
The reading of these files in the library(bookcase) is impossible, marked or shot material acceleration.
On the editing table, these files are correctly read but in normal resolution of overview.
In the French version, the production 4k exists only in 25 p.
I made a production of 161 4096X2160 25p 37Mbs 6mn 45 dry for 39sec in source(spring).
A production of 231 3840X2160 25p 37Mbs 7mn 57 dry for 36 dry in source(spring).
These two files imported on PD13 are badly read in library(bookcase) ( motionless video) but are correctly read in editing table.
I hope that this information is sufficient(self-important) and that the translation Reverso is good???? Hi All

Win10 64bits PRO OEM - i7 3820 3.6Ghz - 18Go de Ram-GTX960 (375.95)

PapidoFrance45

Member Location: France-St jean le blanc Joined: Jan 21, 2011 05:06 Messages: 83 Offline

Nov 23, 2014 09:37

Complement:

Files produced with PD 13 are read with Power DVD14 with an exceptional quality.
The depictions were made with an UC in 60/95 % and an activity(occupation) memory(report) of 8,3 GO.

The reading with Power DVD14, source files in 41Mbs is fluid; the reading of files in 80Mbs is jerky. Hi All

Win10 64bits PRO OEM - i7 3820 3.6Ghz - 18Go de Ram-GTX960 (375.95)