Preview Issues With .MOV Clips

dan_public123

Newbie Joined: Jun 21, 2013 00:45 Messages: 44 Offline

Solved by

Jun 23, 2013 18:47

FYI... This thread was originally named "PD 11 vs <another product> Issues". To keep it on track and focus on the single substantive issue, it is renamed to the current title, " Preview Issues With .MOV Clips".

To summarize the issue: When previewing, clips in AVCHD and MP4 format display fine after changing the TV Format from "NTCS (60 FPS)" to "NTCS (30 FPS)". However, for .MOV clips... Even though they preview fine in my other video editor, high bit rate .MOV clips do NOT preview properly in PD11. They stutter, play slowly and erratically, and/or play at a very low resolution.

For more details, skip down to the substantive posts starting with the post dated: "23/06/2013 21:37:21".

Thanks,

Dan.

----------------------------------

Well much has happened... After reporting PD11 issues in another thread (now resolved) where James1 and Eugen157 helped me, I created a new thread here at the recommendation of BarryTheCrab.

Now that the basic issues are cleared up, <another product> and PD11 seem to be good options for me, but I don't want to the exorbitant <another product> subscription fees. Both produce good quality video and both can add enhancements like titles, cross fades, etc. Here are the same clips in three formats (AVCHD, MP4, and MOV) post processed in <another product> and PD11:

Post Processed in <another product> - https://vimeo.com/68966886

Post Processed in PowerDirector 11 - https://vimeo.com/68966887

Other than the obvious differences in titles, I see no difference in the video produced. That said, I see some issues:

Difficulty in creating titles for the slides - In <another product>, I ran into trouble creating titles. I haven't created titles in this version, so it may be the issue. On the PD11 side, it was easier and faster to create the titles, but I didn't like the glitzy graphics. Again, there may be a simple way of creating simple titles, but in my "noobness", I missed that. I need to read/watch some tutorials.

PD11 seems to be a bit slower overall than <another product> - In <another product> , when you move the timeline slider, the reaction is instantaneous - totally real time. In PD11, there is perceptible lag in the response time. There may be a way to resolve this, but it's not a huge issue in any case. I see other posts about video drivers, etc. I need to check that out.

However...

A more significant issue that I'd like to resolve is that the PD11 preview window shows a lower level resolution while the <another product> window is crystal clear. Screen shots of each are attached. The preview window was set to 75% zoom and HD/Full resolution. Any way to improve this in PD?

Thanks,

Dan.

p.s. My system's DXDiag is attached (the 64 bit version with my name in the file name) for reference.


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Filename	DanClark64DxDiag.txt	Download
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This message was edited 11 times. Last update was at Jun 25. 2013 11:43

Director Suite with PD11
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CubbyHouseFilms

Senior Contributor Location: Melbourne, Australia Joined: Jul 14, 2009 04:23 Messages: 2208 Offline

Jun 23, 2013 22:58

A more significant issue that I'd like to resolve is that the PD11 preview window shows a lower level resolution while the Premiere window is crystal clear. Screen shots of each are attached. The preview window was set to 75% zoom and HD/Full resolution. Any way to improve this in PD?

Hi

Try using 'Fit' instead of 75%. You can also undock the preview window.

The limitations you are experiencing might be because of the trial version.

Happy editing Happing editing

Best Regards

Neil
CubbyHouseFilms
My Youtube Channel
My Vimeo Channel
PD3.5, 5, 6 & 7. Computer: Dell Dimension 5150, Intel Pen. 2.80 GHz, 2GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8600GT 256MB, Windows XP Pro!!
PD8 Ultra v3022. Computer: Dell Studio 1747, Intel, i7 Q740 1.73 GHz, 8GB RAM, ATI Mob. Radeon HD 560v 1GB, Windows 7 Ult. 64
PD10 Ultra v2023. Computer: HP Pavilion dv7, Intel, i7 2630 2.00 GHz, 8GB RAM, ATI Mob. Radeon HD 6770 2GB, Windows 7 Pre. 64
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Xerox

Contributor Location: California, USA Joined: Aug 09, 2009 01:36 Messages: 446 Offline

Jun 23, 2013 22:58

It is really bad taste to mention non Cyberlink products on this forum. I won't be surprised if this thread doesn't get locked, but it should. Gateway DX4380, AMD A8-5500 Quad Core 3.2GHz with ATI Radeon HD 7560D; 16GB RAM; 1 TB SATA 7200 RPM; Windows 8 Pro 64-bit; PDR11, PDVD12.

dan_public123

Newbie Joined: Jun 21, 2013 00:45 Messages: 44 Offline

Jun 23, 2013 23:38

Quote: It is really bad taste to mention non Cyberlink products on this forum. I won't be surprised if this thread doesn't get locked, but it should.

Are you having a bad day?

I'm trying to determine if PD11 can meet my needs. How the @!#$ can you eval a product is you can't discuss it and post the results?!? If you can't get information PD11 AS IT COMPARES TO OTHER PRODUCTS here, where can you get it?

If your attitude is the norm for this forum, then it's nothing but a gathering place for clueless fanboys! Further, it means that the PD11 is garbage. If a product cannot stand comparison, it's a failure. It's obvious that you have a low opinion of PD11 and feel the need to protect this "low quality" product. Keep your insecurity to yourself. I don't share your low opinion of PD11 and don't want to hear your @#$@.

Since I'm not a clueless fanboy, I evaluate products to see if one meets my needs better than another. Since I'm spending MY hard-earned money, I have the right to ask questions and evaluate the product.

Here's a news flash FANBOY... PD11 compares VERY well with <another product> . In many ways it's better. However, the vast majority of people consider PD11 a prosumer product and consider <another product> a professional product. How is it possible that a prosumer product can compare with a much more expensive, professional product? It does!

Your attitude will drive many people away from PD11. Get lost!

Dan.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at Jun 24. 2013 01:38

Director Suite with PD11
PC: Win7/64, 32Gb memory, SSD sys disk, Raid 5 data disk, Raid 0 production disk.

dan_public123

Newbie Joined: Jun 21, 2013 00:45 Messages: 44 Offline

Jun 23, 2013 23:50

Quote:

A more significant issue that I'd like to resolve is that the PD11 preview window shows a lower level resolution while the <another product> window is crystal clear. Screen shots of each are attached. The preview window was set to 75% zoom and HD/Full resolution. Any way to improve this in PD?

Hi

Try using 'Fit' instead of 75%. You can also undock the preview window.

The limitations you are experiencing might be because of the trial version.

Happy editing

Neil,

Thanks for the info. The eval version has all of those options. I set the Preview to the top-most option - Full Preview. And I tried "Fit" and "100%", and then used "75%" to capture the screen to ensure that the images were comparable.

FYI... I noticed another thread that mentioned something about shadow copies (I think that was it). I'll try that option. If I can resolve the preview issue, I'll buy PD11 because it has all the features I need and the output is very comparable. (Actually, I can't see any difference in the output, even using source files with three different formats on the same timeline.)

One interesting feature that PD11 has but <another product> does NOT have is that PD11 can import and convert RAW files (I have a Panasonic GH3). I wasn't surprised that PD11 had that feature. I was very surprised that Premiere did not have it. Nice feature.

Regards,

Dan.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at Jun 24. 2013 01:36

Director Suite with PD11
PC: Win7/64, 32Gb memory, SSD sys disk, Raid 5 data disk, Raid 0 production disk.

dan_public123

Newbie Joined: Jun 21, 2013 00:45 Messages: 44 Offline

Jun 24, 2013 00:37

I found part of the issue - TV Format was set to "NTCS (60 FPS)". I reset that to "NTCS (60 FPS)" and that resolved the screen fuzziness issue with the AVCHD and MP4. That said...

MOV still seems to have some random issues from preview to preview. Sometimes it's fuzzy. And sometimes it's clear but the video stops and starts. Setting the "Enable HD video processing..." did not seem to have any affect, so I left it off.

My video card is a GeForce GTX 470 (couple years old). I just updated the drivers, but no change. I think it's a pretty decent card, but maybe I need to upgrade it.

Has anyone seen preview issues with high bit rate (50 MBps) MOV files?

Dan.


Filename	GeneralPreferences.jpg	Download
Description
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This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at Jun 24. 2013 01:39

Director Suite with PD11
PC: Win7/64, 32Gb memory, SSD sys disk, Raid 5 data disk, Raid 0 production disk.

dan_public123

Newbie Joined: Jun 21, 2013 00:45 Messages: 44 Offline

Jun 24, 2013 01:46

Because of the rude comment by Xerox , I just went through this thread and replaced any mention of another company's product with "<another product>" to protect his sensibilities. The whole thread now reads poorly, but that's tough. the breaks.

Right now I have a queasy feeling about CyberLink's products. I think they are pretty good, but being treated rudely is the sign of a very bad forum and reflects badly on the products. Are there any other PowerDisplay forums around where new users will not be attacked?

Dan. Director Suite with PD11
PC: Win7/64, 32Gb memory, SSD sys disk, Raid 5 data disk, Raid 0 production disk.

CubbyHouseFilms

Senior Contributor Location: Melbourne, Australia Joined: Jul 14, 2009 04:23 Messages: 2208 Offline

Jun 24, 2013 01:54

Has anyone seen preview issues with high bit rate (50 MBps) MOV files?

I have a PC laptop and a MacBook Pro using FCPX.

I'll give you three guesses what computer works best with the MOV files

As MOVs are related to Apple ensure that you have the current Quicktime time installed - here's the link:

http://support.apple.com/downloads/#quicktime

Happy editing Happing editing

Best Regards

Neil
CubbyHouseFilms
My Youtube Channel
My Vimeo Channel
PD3.5, 5, 6 & 7. Computer: Dell Dimension 5150, Intel Pen. 2.80 GHz, 2GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8600GT 256MB, Windows XP Pro!!
PD8 Ultra v3022. Computer: Dell Studio 1747, Intel, i7 Q740 1.73 GHz, 8GB RAM, ATI Mob. Radeon HD 560v 1GB, Windows 7 Ult. 64
PD10 Ultra v2023. Computer: HP Pavilion dv7, Intel, i7 2630 2.00 GHz, 8GB RAM, ATI Mob. Radeon HD 6770 2GB, Windows 7 Pre. 64
PD12 Ultra v2930. Computer: HP Pavilion dv7, Intel, i7 2630 2.00 GHz, 8GB RAM, ATI Mob. Radeon HD 6770 2GB, Windows 7 Pre. 64
PD13 Ultim v3516. Computer: HP Pavilion dv7, Intel, i7 2630 2.00 GHz, 8GB RAM, ATI Mob. Radeon HD 6770 2GB, Windows 7 Pre. 64
PD16 Live v2101 Computer: HP Pavilion dv7, Intel, i7 2630 2.00 GHz, 16GB RAM, ATI Mob.Radeon HD 6770 2GB, Windows 7 Pre. 64
Director Suite 6: PowerDirector 16 Live, PhotoDirector 9, ColorDirector 6, AudioDirector 8

Cameras: Sony(s) HXR-NX5P, HXR-NX70P, NEX-VG10E, a6300 4k, HDR TG5E, GoPro 4 Black, Canon 6D DSLR

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Dafydd B

Senior Contributor Joined: Aug 26, 2006 08:20 Messages: 11973 Offline

Jun 24, 2013 04:44

Hi dan_public123 ,
Thank you for making the changes. PM sent.
Forum Moderator.

dan_public123

Newbie Joined: Jun 21, 2013 00:45 Messages: 44 Offline

Jun 24, 2013 12:13

Quote:

Has anyone seen preview issues with high bit rate (50 MBps) MOV files?

I have a PC laptop and a MacBook Pro using FCPX.

I'll give you three guesses what computer works best with the MOV files

As MOVs are related to Apple ensure that you have the current Quicktime time installed - here's the link:

http://support.apple.com/downloads/#quicktime

Happy editing

Neil,

Thanks for the feedback. Regarding MOV preview...

I think the MOV preview issue is specific to PD11. This same clip previews fine in <another product>. My version of the quicktime driver is up to date, but I "repair"ed it anyway. No change.

As another test outside of DP11, I opened the raw .MOV file by double-clicking it. Windows Media Player popped up and started playing the clip just fine. No slow down, starts and stops, or fuzziness.

So the issue looks like it's specific to PD11 - a setting or maybe a bug. I'd like to get this resolved. Anything else you can think of to resolve this MOV preview issue? Any settings I can change?

Thanks and regards,

Dan. Director Suite with PD11
PC: Win7/64, 32Gb memory, SSD sys disk, Raid 5 data disk, Raid 0 production disk.

Eugen157

Senior Contributor Location: Palm Springs area, So.CA Joined: Dec 10, 2012 13:57 Messages: 662 Offline

Jun 24, 2013 15:26

I find it bizarre to get upset about mentioning an other product.

I have done that a number of times, how else can you determine that PD is the good product it is,unless you compare it to the competition?

Eugene

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Jun 24. 2013 15:29

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Dafydd B

Senior Contributor Joined: Aug 26, 2006 08:20 Messages: 11973 Offline

Jun 25, 2013 03:46

Hi Dan,
Following our excellent PM exchange. I'll jump into this thread and see what can be done to assist you.

1. Thank you for the diagnostic file and your images.
2. Looking through your diagnostic. Which drives do you draw/store your video and image files from/on? I have noted that large drives have caused PDR11 problems with response times.
3. I'd like to have some samples from your Panasonic GH3 please. I don't have any images or footage to work with to assist/check out.
3-1. MOV file 5 seconds long, unedited please.
3-2. A few image files, might be useful to have.

I don't believe Dan is doing a comparison test (poorly titled Topic) in the way he's posting here. He is stating quite clearly that Adobe Premiere (which he is experienced in) will play his MOV and PowerDirector 11 isn't (etc). The aim here is to address the MOV file in relation to PDR11. Many quality still cameras (such as a Canon 7D) produce video create to a very high bitrate and that does cause display issues on some systems. Dan's system is specifically designed for video editing and should not be encountering display or useage issues. I'd like the sample files to find out if my system (or any other editor's) can cope with the MOV.

Dafydd

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jun 25. 2013 03:47

dan_public123

Newbie Joined: Jun 21, 2013 00:45 Messages: 44 Offline

Jun 25, 2013 06:32

Quote: Hi Dan,
Following our excellent PM exchange. I'll jump into this thread and see what can be done to assist you.

1. Thank you for the diagnostic file and your images.
2. Looking through your diagnostic. Which drives do you draw/store your video and image files from/on? I have noted that large drives have caused PDR11 problems with response times.
3. I'd like to have some samples from your Panasonic GH3 please. I don't have any images or footage to work with to assist/check out.
3-1. MOV file 5 seconds long, unedited please.
3-2. A few image files, might be useful to have.

I don't believe Dan is doing a comparison test (poorly titled Topic) in the way he's posting here. He is stating quite clearly that Adobe Premiere (which he is experienced in) will play his MOV and PowerDirector 11 isn't (etc). The aim here is to address the MOV file in relation to PDR11. Many quality still cameras (such as a Canon 7D) produce video create to a very high bitrate and that does cause display issues on some systems. Dan's system is specifically designed for video editing and should not be encountering display or useage issues. I'd like the sample files to find out if my system (or any other editor's) can cope with the MOV.

Dafydd

Dafydd,

Many thanks for looking at this. Hopefully my response here will make sense (it's 3:20 am here).

Regarding the drives (#2):

- The system and all apps are installed on a 256Gb Samsung 830 Pro SSD.

- The projects and source media are on a 5TB, six-disk, Raid 5 drive with a seventh disk as a hot backup. The disks are Seagate Constellation, 7200 rpm, 1TB enterprise-level SAS drives.

- The PD11 export folder is on a 600GB, two-disk, Raid 0 drive. The disks are Western Digital Velociraptor, 10K rpm, 300GB SATA drives.

- The SSD system/app drive is connected to a 6GB/second motherboard SATA port.

- The Raid 0 and Raid 5 arrays are connected to an Areca Raid 1882-12 Controller with 1GB ram cache. This is a PCIE 3.0 raid adapter card that supports a combo of SAS and SATA drives: http://www.areca.us/products/1882.htm.

Regarding PD11's issues with large drives, I'm surprised to hear this. In any case, this issue is limited to 1) previews only and 2) .MOV clips only. After rendering the final output, the video plays fine in Windows Media Player - no problems with the .MOV portion. Also, the original .MOV clips are fine when played standalone (PD11 not running) in Windows Media Player and the Quicktime player.

Regarding the sample files (#3):

- I will create some additional screen shots showing the fuzziness.

- At twenty seconds, the .MOV clip is too long, so I'll create a new five-second clip. At about 30MB, one issue with this new clip is how to transfer it to you. I can FTP it up to my web server (an MDD Hosting Linux server that I use for my weather website) and then figure out how to give you FTP access. If you have a better option, I'll be happy to use that because I'm not much of a Linux jock.

Regarding this thread, I agree about the title (not the best) and there are several issues munged together. If you're willing, please snip out the relevant posts and create a new thread with a title something like, "Preview Issue With .MOV Clips". Or, if you prefer, I'll be happy to do that. Please let me know.

Thanks again,

Dan. Director Suite with PD11
PC: Win7/64, 32Gb memory, SSD sys disk, Raid 5 data disk, Raid 0 production disk.

Dafydd B

Senior Contributor Joined: Aug 26, 2006 08:20 Messages: 11973 Offline

Jun 25, 2013 08:48

Hi Dan,
Thanks for the additional information.
Mov sample can be attached/uploaded here just as you've done with the other files.
You can change the title - excellent idea.
I'm loathed to remove content at the best of times, invaribly someone will get upset. Let's just carry on and keep going with the mov issue.

Please clarify what I'm sure you've stated already, you're using the Trial version of PDR11, correct? There are user limitations with the trial for HD files. I will be checking your MOV using the FULL version of PDR11 as will other forum members.

Just so you know, please read the FAQ: http://www.cyberlink.com/support/faq-content.do?id=2317
and
https://asknet-en.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2215/kw/refund

Dafydd

dan_public123

Newbie Joined: Jun 21, 2013 00:45 Messages: 44 Offline

Jun 25, 2013 11:52

Quote: Hi Dan,
Thanks for the additional information.
Mov sample can be attached/uploaded here just as you've done with the other files.
You can change the title - excellent idea.
I'm loathed to remove content at the best of times, invaribly someone will get upset. Let's just carry on and keep going with the mov issue.

Please clarify what I'm sure you've stated already, you're using the Trial version of PDR11, correct? There are user limitations with the trial for HD files. I will be checking your MOV using the FULL version of PDR11 as will other forum members.

Just so you know, please read the FAQ: http://www.cyberlink.com/support/faq-content.do?id=2317
and
https://asknet-en.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2215/kw/refund

Dafydd

Dafydd,

I modified the thread title, provided a quick summary at the top, and pointed readers to the start of the issue posts dated, "23/06/2013 21:37:21".

Since there may be an issue with the trial version, I just ordered the "Director Suite". Although I was not originally interested in PhotoDirector, the minimal cost increase over the "PowerDirector 11 Ultimate Suite" seemed worthwhile and I may not have to buy Adobe Lightroom when I cancel my Adobe CC subscription.

Also, I logged a bug report with CyberLink. Hopefully we can resolve this by working inside and outside the company.

I'll report back after I get the full version installed. If the issue still exists, I'll upload screenshots and a 5 second .MOV video.

Best regards,

Dan.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jun 25. 2013 11:53

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dan_public123

Newbie Joined: Jun 21, 2013 00:45 Messages: 44 Offline

Jun 25, 2013 13:44

I purchased and installed the full Director Suite. No change in the .MOV preview. Still broken.

I'd like to resolve this. If we can figure out a solution, or if CyberLink finds a bug and commits to fix it, then it becomes a non-issue. I can live with not using .MOV format for a while.

I'll post a thread in the PhotoDirector forum, but my first impression with PhotoDirector is very poor. When it imported all my GH3's RAW files they imported with very bad pink cast. I'm not pleased with PhotoDirector so far.

Dan.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jun 25. 2013 14:18

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dan_public123

Newbie Joined: Jun 21, 2013 00:45 Messages: 44 Offline

Jun 25, 2013 20:05

Quick update... When I tried PhotoDirector, it imported my raw images with a pink cast. So I deinstalled everything, manually cleaned out the files, folders, and registry entries that the deinstaller failed to remove, and reinstalled everything. That fixed the PhotoDirector problem. But the .MOV preview problem still exists. However...

When I drop the .MOV clip to the timeline, a very strange message pops up indicating that the imported file frame rate of 59.94 FPS does not match the project frame rate of 59.94 FPS. ??? (See screen capture attached.)

I suspect that this has something do with the .MOV problem, but I'm not sure how to fix it. Any ideas? Has anyone else seen this before? Know the cause? Any solution?

Thanks,

Dan.


Filename	StrangeErrorMessage.jpg	Download
Description
Filesize	282 Kbytes
Downloaded:	246 time(s)

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Cranston

Senior Contributor Location: USA Joined: Aug 17, 2007 02:26 Messages: 1667 Offline

Jun 25, 2013 20:45

Quote: ...a very strange message pops up indicating that the imported file frame rate of 59.94 FPS does not match the project frame rate of 59.94 FPS. Has anyone else seen this before?

Hi Dan,

I can’t really add anything to this thread other than to confirm that yes, I have gotten that odd pop-up message a couple of times, where it says the frame rates do not match, though the rates stated are identical. However, for me, this was with .wmv files, not .mov files. I double checked the frame rate in Media Info, and all was correct. Yep, very puzzling when one sees that message.

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ynotfish

Senior Contributor Location: N.S.W. Australia Joined: May 08, 2009 02:06 Messages: 9977 Offline

Jun 25, 2013 21:02

Hi Dan -

As Cranston says, that error (false positive) occurs occasionally & has been reported often in these forums. I just turn that confirmation off in Preferences - that way the boy doesn't get to cry "Wolf".

I may have missed it, Dan, but what's the source of your MOV clips? Looking at your DxDiag, your PC could chew mine up and spit it out, but I haven't experienced the same jittery playback with high bitrate MOV files (~38-45MBps).

Did you resolve your initial preview quality issue? Here - the display of Canon MOV files in PD & "another product" is just about the same, unless I deliberately lower the preview quality in PD. I've attached a screenshot.

Cheers - Tony


Filename	PD11_Another Product.jpg	Download
Description
Filesize	1629 Kbytes
Downloaded:	240 time(s)

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dan_public123

Newbie Joined: Jun 21, 2013 00:45 Messages: 44 Offline

Jun 25, 2013 21:51

Cranston, Tony,

Thanks for the feedback.

Perhaps the error message is not related to the .MOV issue. At this point, I'm grasping at straws.

The .MOV file is a 50MBps file from my Panasonic GH3. 50MBps is a bit higher than your .MOV files, but not that much higher. And my system (a PC with 32GB of memory and a fast disk subsystem) was designed and built (by me) specifically to perform photo and video editing on high resolution images and clips. It should not have this issue. For reference, the same clips preview perfectly in my other video editor (which will remain unnamed )

Regarding the file... It is an unmodified file - never touched by any editor. This afternoon, I took a 5 second clip to upload for DafyDD's use. No change in the strange behavior. To summarize that behavior:

- Sometimes it jitters and stops, or lags way behind the audio.
- Other times, it displays at a very low resolution.
- Still other times it does both - displays at a low resolution AND jitters and stops.

I just want my .MOV clips to preview properly at full resolution in PD11. I do NOT want to raise a ruckus and compare PD11 to other products.

Thanks and regards,

Dan. Director Suite with PD11
PC: Win7/64, 32Gb memory, SSD sys disk, Raid 5 data disk, Raid 0 production disk.