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Semicolons to Separate Time?
Dorsodude [Avatar]
Newbie Location: Snohomish, WA Joined: Dec 27, 2008 17:18 Messages: 10 Offline
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I know this is purely aesthetic, but why does PD9 use semicolons as a delimiter in time notations? I've always seen time written as HH:MM:SS. In PD9, it's now HH;MM;SS. Did anyone else notice this? Is this a bug or "by design?"

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Dec 30. 2010 18:16

Cap'n Kevin
Senior Contributor Location: Chebeague Island, Maine Joined: Dec 26, 2008 20:22 Messages: 2011 Offline
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looks like an oversight to me.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at Dec 31. 2010 06:53


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JL_JL [Avatar]
Senior Contributor Location: Arizona, USA Joined: Oct 01, 2006 20:01 Messages: 6091 Offline
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Oversight, I doubt it. Just a different part of the world! "." and "," and ":" and ";" used differently in number notations.

Jeff
Carl312
Senior Contributor Location: Texas, USA Joined: Mar 16, 2010 20:11 Messages: 9090 Offline
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The time separators are colons in PD8.

I doubt it is because of the World standard.

It is possible that your region selection for your computer may affect the time separator. Carl312: Windows 10 64-bit 8 GB RAM,AMD Phenom II X4 965 3.4 GHz,ATI Radeon HD 5770 1GB,240GB SSD,two 1TB HDs.

vn800rider
Senior Contributor Location: Darwen, UK Joined: May 15, 2008 04:32 Messages: 1949 Offline
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I noted the change in PD9 during beta testing, and, sadly , l looked up the standards. Internationally, ISO 8601:2004 seems to be the current one

Example from Wiki (rather than paying 130 swiss francs for the published standard)
"ISO 8601 Data elements and interchange formats — Information interchange — Representation of dates and times is an international standard covering the exchange of date and time-related data. It was issued by the International Organization for Standardization (ISO) and was first published in 1988. The purpose of this standard is to provide an unambiguous and well-defined method of representing dates and times, so as to avoid misinterpretation of numeric representations of dates and times, particularly when data is transferred between countries with different conventions for writing numeric dates and times."

"Representations can be done in one of two formats—a basic format with a minimal number of separators or an extended format with separators added to enhance human readability.[4] The separator used between date values (year, month, week, and day) is the hyphen, while the colon is used as the separator between time values (hours, minutes, and seconds)."

An easy Wiki article on country conventions can be found here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Date_and_time_notation_by_country

Quite which convention CL has adopted is open to question?

Cheers
Adrian Life is really simple, but we insist on making it complicated. (see below)
Confucius
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1Nina
Senior Contributor Location: Norway, 50km southwest of Oslo Joined: Oct 08, 2008 04:12 Messages: 1070 Offline
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Adrian.....gosh, I learn so much from you,
(especially the English language. I now have 2 dictionaries beside my computer)

I looked up the wikipage.
What is given there for Norway is accurate.


Skål
Just something.
https://www.petitpoisvideo.com
BarryTheCrab
Senior Contributor Location: USA Joined: Nov 06, 2008 22:18 Messages: 6240 Offline
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Just 2 dictionaries?
When HE posts, I also grab my thesaurus, aspirin, barf bucket, and cancel all appointments... HP Envy Phoenix/4thGen i7-4770(4@3.4GHz~turbo>3.9)
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vn800rider
Senior Contributor Location: Darwen, UK Joined: May 15, 2008 04:32 Messages: 1949 Offline
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Thank God, my tactics are working! Life is really simple, but we insist on making it complicated. (see below)
Confucius
AMD Phenom IIX6 1055T, win10, 5 internal drives, 7 usb drives, struggling power supply.
JL_JL [Avatar]
Senior Contributor Location: Arizona, USA Joined: Oct 01, 2006 20:01 Messages: 6091 Offline
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My second guess is that it denotes dropped frame time code vs real time code notation. I don't know what the standard is, the book I have simply states typically a semicolon is only used in the frames section to denote dropped frame time code. You can obviously see the NTSC dropped frame in PD9 if you go to:
00;00;59;29 next frame 00;01;00;02, dropped ;00 and ;01 frames
vs
00;00;58;29 next frame 00;00;59;00 next frame 00;00;59;01

Jeff

EDIT:
From WIKI for what it's worth: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMPTE_time_code
Drop frame is usually represented with a semi-colon ( ; ) or period (.) between the seconds and frames whereas non-drop retains the colon ( : ). The period is usually used on VTRs and other devices that don't have the ability to display a semi-colon.
Example: drop frame = "HH:MM:SS;FF" or "HH:MM:SS.FF", non-drop frame = "HH:MM:SS:FF"


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Dec 31. 2010 10:15

Cap'n Kevin
Senior Contributor Location: Chebeague Island, Maine Joined: Dec 26, 2008 20:22 Messages: 2011 Offline
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So the oversight was on my part...not Cyberlink's!!

That was a good one Jeff!

So if you want to see a Colon in the counter of PD9, you simply change in your preferences, in the General tab, select "NO" in the dropdown list of "use dropframe timecode"...and the colon appears in the time counter.

It you select "YES", then you get the semi-colon....just as Jeff described.

It's all very interesting....I never changed the setting before.

Kevin

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Dec 31. 2010 12:24


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JL_JL [Avatar]
Senior Contributor Location: Arizona, USA Joined: Oct 01, 2006 20:01 Messages: 6091 Offline
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Quote: So if you want to see a Colon in the counter of PD9, you simply change in your preferences, in the General tab, select "NO" in the dropdown list of "use dropframe timecode"...and the colon appears in the time counter.
It's more than just appearance. The time counter will be different to account for the dropped frames. Put like at least a hour of footage in the TL and toggle back a forth, you will see. So to say somthing occurs right at 01:00:00:00 depends what timecode, you maybe off more than 3seconds.

Jeff
Cap'n Kevin
Senior Contributor Location: Chebeague Island, Maine Joined: Dec 26, 2008 20:22 Messages: 2011 Offline
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And just to clarify...that is because NTSC standard is 29.97 frames per second, and not 30 frames per second. So depending on the length of the video...it will eventually lose some time, and the drop frame time code accounts for this loss.

Correct?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Dec 31. 2010 13:04


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vn800rider
Senior Contributor Location: Darwen, UK Joined: May 15, 2008 04:32 Messages: 1949 Offline
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Wicked, Jeff. A resolution to this anomaly in PD8?

http://forum.cyberlink.com/forum/posts/list/9864.page#43179

Cheers
Adrian Life is really simple, but we insist on making it complicated. (see below)
Confucius
AMD Phenom IIX6 1055T, win10, 5 internal drives, 7 usb drives, struggling power supply.
Dafydd B [Avatar]
Senior Contributor Joined: Aug 26, 2006 08:20 Messages: 11973 Offline
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Well I'm blowed.

This was raised in ...

Well done Jeff.

Dafydd
Dorsodude [Avatar]
Newbie Location: Snohomish, WA Joined: Dec 27, 2008 17:18 Messages: 10 Offline
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Odd that it defaults to the non-standard notation, at least in my book. That was an easy fix. Thanks to you all!

Bill
JL_JL [Avatar]
Senior Contributor Location: Arizona, USA Joined: Oct 01, 2006 20:01 Messages: 6091 Offline
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Quote: A resolution to this anomaly in PD8?
Yep, I don't think the logic there is quite right though, (1 frame by 31:09) but it is the anomaly. As an interest, go to 00:10:00:00 in PD8 and try to go back a frame with a mouse click on the previous frame icon or the keyboard comma. Will not work, you can drag the scrubber back a frame to 00:09:59:28, there is the actual dropping of some of the timecode "labels" in order to make an hour of timecode match an hour on the clock. With the scrubber on 00:10:00:00, you will be able to advance a frame to 00:10:00:01 though. This "adjustment" occurs every 10 minutes to keep things essentially timed.

I think PD9 now essentially exposed this through the preference setting.

Quote: Well done Jeff.
thanks

Jeff
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